Author Topic: Reasons why it's called that...  (Read 4043 times)

Offline Maj

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Re: Reasons why it's called that...
« Reply #50 on: January 19, 2019, 12:38:20 pm »
Hobnail Hole (the new way into Thrupe Lane Swallet)- so named since the sole of a hobnail boot was found near the surface when the dig started. The hobnail sole is now nailed to the branch we used to mount the spoil hauling pulley above the entrance shaft.

The rift chamber where the connection to Upper Butts' Chamber was made got its name for the following reasons. When we dug our way into the rift chamber, the stream we were following disappeared through a low letterbox slot in the right hand wall. We assumed we would be there sometime, after first eliminating any other ways on we planned to enlarge the letterbox slot which we anticipated would take a long time. Two of our ATLAS diggers are volunteers at The Somerset & Dorset Heritage Trust Railway in Midsomer Norton. Also the average age of the regular ATLAS Hobnail diggers was..... well lets just say its probably not too far off the average age of care home residents.

The chamber was named The Waiting Room.   


Maj.
Confucius say "War does not determine who is right, war determine who is left."

Online Katie

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Re: Reasons why it's called that...
« Reply #51 on: January 19, 2019, 10:23:13 pm »
Saw this one of facebook the other day and thought it was interesting.
Never knew how Suicide cave got that name......
Although I have fact checked it - so hopefully it is true........

On the 8th of January 1927 a Castleton youth, Fred Bannister was roaming around the caves of Winnats Pass when he stumbled across a young woman, slumped with her back against a rock within the entrance to Horseshoe Cave..
Realising something was amiss, he raced down to the village police station to summon assistance. Upon returning to the cave, they found a man's body lying a short distance from the girl, both had been dead for several days.
Harry Fallows and Marjorie Coe Stewart had not been seen by their families since New Year's eve; she was 17, single, worked in a warehouse and was described as bright with an artistic temperament; he was 26, an unemployed driver with a disposition toward depression and gambling, living apart from his wife and child he stayed occasionally with his sister, who resided on the same street as Marjorie in Moston, Manchester. They had known each other two years but Marjorie's father had previously warned Harry off after discovering his marital status and no one had been aware that the pair were still in contact until shortly after their disappearance they sent telegrams explaining they had left together and would not be returning for some time.
Fred Bannister, it transpired, had seen Harry and Marjorie in the cave the week before, the pair had asked Fred and the friends he was with to put their torches out as they had shone them into the entrance, disturbing them.
The youths left them in peace... and at some stage soon afterwards, the pair must have consumed Lysol poison which they poured from a bottle into a porcelain cup and saucer ....both of which were found broken between their bodies.
The Coroner, summing up at the inquest decided the couple had left Manchester with little money between them and once that was spent, they had taken this final course of action. There appeared no evidence that they were of unsound mind and both seemed to have agreed to die, though they could not determine which had passed first.
Many from the village volunteered to go up and help retrieve the bodies from the narrow cave entrance, the light was fading and violent winds howled down the Pass, blowing the helpers across the cold dead corpses as they slid down the steep icy path.
Greengrocer Ted Medwell drove his truck up to collect the grisly load but the gusting Gale made it impossible to manoeuvre the vehicle within the tight Pass... eventually the distressed folk carried the couple down to the Castle Hotel, where they could be stored for identification.
Harry and Marjorie were buried together in St Edmunds an hour after the inquest which was held in the Castleton Restaurant... only a few relatives were present but a group of villagers stood in silent respect nearby.
Ever since then Horseshoe Cave was referred to as Suicide Cave

Offline Pitlamp

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Re: Reasons why it's called that...
« Reply #52 on: January 20, 2019, 07:27:09 am »
Thanks Katie - I never knew that sad story.

I wonder if there is a gravestone in the church yard, for further verification?

Offline SamT

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Re: Reasons why it's called that...
« Reply #53 on: January 20, 2019, 08:29:07 am »
To add a little credence,  growing up in Castleton,  that was always my understanding of the etymology. I didn't know there we're actual names for the couple, but just that a couple had committed suicide there. I think I probably read it in some sort of 'ghosts of Castleton' booklet that was probably stocked in the old barn giftshop in the marketplace and most likely  concluded that "on a windy night you can still hear their cries" or some such.

Offline mikem

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Re: Reasons why it's called that...
« Reply #54 on: January 20, 2019, 09:00:30 am »
If you Google chstrial suicide, a pdf comes up with some newspaper clippings to the above (& there are many other castleton stories on that wordpress, including Odin mine and the finding of treak cliff cavern).

The "cries" are supposed to come from the murdered couple (also has some info on the local lead mining):
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=T0qIAwAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false
« Last Edit: January 20, 2019, 09:22:20 am by mikem »

Offline mikem

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Re: Reasons why it's called that...
« Reply #55 on: January 20, 2019, 09:38:58 am »
Interestingly, Harry Fallows was arrested after traveling with Percy Toplis (The Monocled Mutineer) in 1920 (see the link to the murder of taxi driver George Spicer & mention of Fallows' suicide at the end of this long account):
https://pixelsurgery.wordpress.com/2016/06/06/percy-toplis-bothy-tomintoul/

Further info: https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=cJApCgAAQBAJ&pg=PT145&lpg=PT145&dq="harry+fallows"&source=bl&ots=zQTnysUZGe&sig=ACfU3U3VFh6m4Y-VQctgW3OELktrUhD4GQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwie9brTjfzfAhWGSRUIHVAtAsw4ChDoATAJeg QICRAB#v=onepage&q="harry%20fallows"&f=false

Photo apparently of Harry Fallows in 1920:
https://photos.globalimageworks.com/sidney-george-spicer-murder-harry-fallows-percy-toplis-bulford-mx2856429187.html
« Last Edit: January 20, 2019, 10:11:13 am by mikem »

Offline mikem

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Re: Reasons why it's called that...
« Reply #56 on: January 20, 2019, 10:20:55 am »
Their suicide made national news (this one from the Scotsman, but it even got as far as Australia & New Zealand). The link is the chstrial one I mentioned above:
http://ceegee-viewfromahill.blogspot.com/2018/12/marjorie-stewart-and-harry-fallows.html?m=1

& trying to separate fact from fiction on Percy Toplis, including the accusation that Fallows actually killed George Spicer:
https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/92360-percy-topliss/
« Last Edit: January 20, 2019, 10:41:43 am by mikem »