cap n chris
Well-known member
Yes, but more like 120-150 years old, blasted out by Cornish miners (paid by the fathom). It achieved a recorded depth of 105m.
Cheddar - Charterhouse on Mendip Main trunk Routes
- Thread starter whitelackington
- Start date
whitelackington
New member
I was not actually suggesting that stainsby's shaft was Pre-Roman or Roman, just that as it has gone so deep, it may have captured the Upper Flood Swallet Water and thus UFS now only has a minute trickle in a monster passage.
At one time, it must have had far more water in it.
One other point, A Roman Point.
The Romans were not really into sustainability, they would have wanted to get the lead/silver out as quick as was possible, then much of it, went straight off to Rome.
They would have needed copious volumes of water for there mining and refining business.
The lead, left as fully refined pigs.
So where did they get the water from.
They could have built reservoirs and aquaducts but i do not think these have been located.
There is usually little surface water.
So the only other option is to sink a well.
The Romans sunk wells more than a hundred metres deep & in England.
So perhaps, they sunk a shaft and hit a large source of water.
But which shaft?
As I said in my earlier posting, over two thousand years of messing the surface and near surface of this part of mendip, almost certainly has altered the hydrology
At one time, it must have had far more water in it.
One other point, A Roman Point.
The Romans were not really into sustainability, they would have wanted to get the lead/silver out as quick as was possible, then much of it, went straight off to Rome.
They would have needed copious volumes of water for there mining and refining business.
The lead, left as fully refined pigs.
So where did they get the water from.
They could have built reservoirs and aquaducts but i do not think these have been located.
There is usually little surface water.
So the only other option is to sink a well.
The Romans sunk wells more than a hundred metres deep & in England.
So perhaps, they sunk a shaft and hit a large source of water.
But which shaft?
As I said in my earlier posting, over two thousand years of messing the surface and near surface of this part of mendip, almost certainly has altered the hydrology
cap n chris
Well-known member
Townfield (the field with the Roman town in it... the clue's in the name) is on the springline; there's plenty of water at Charterhouse; a fair amount goes straight into Manor Farm Swallet as I'm sure you've noticed; the rest percolates into the various caves in the Charterhouse Reserve.
The monster passage in UFS is a misfit, most probably a result of periglacial flood waters. Remember, this part of Mendip has lost at least the top 90m of geology in which there's a strong likelihood of caves having existed. Also, the geology of Charterhouse is complicated by the localised faulting and associated upwelling of deep geothermal springs which deposited the lead. The faulting is highly visible in the surface in the form of the rakes and fissures running for several hundred metres and covering a considerable area. This faulting would/could have intercepted/interfered with any cave hydrology/network.
I seriously doubt whether a Cornish Mine shaft has anything to do with it.
The Victorian lead works were supplied by a wooden launder (an aquaduct) running for some 1.5km from Longwood Valley alongside the present Velvet Bottom (the line of which is still partially visible). This source of water for the industrial process and the engineering associated with bringing it to augment the springs available locally would certainly have been within the capacity of the Romans to have exploited. I think you are underestimating their abilities. Anyway, the Romans were exploiting the surface veins whereas the Victorians were resmelting the smitham-rich sediments so the relative water requirements wouldn't equate.
The monster passage in UFS is a misfit, most probably a result of periglacial flood waters. Remember, this part of Mendip has lost at least the top 90m of geology in which there's a strong likelihood of caves having existed. Also, the geology of Charterhouse is complicated by the localised faulting and associated upwelling of deep geothermal springs which deposited the lead. The faulting is highly visible in the surface in the form of the rakes and fissures running for several hundred metres and covering a considerable area. This faulting would/could have intercepted/interfered with any cave hydrology/network.
I seriously doubt whether a Cornish Mine shaft has anything to do with it.
The Victorian lead works were supplied by a wooden launder (an aquaduct) running for some 1.5km from Longwood Valley alongside the present Velvet Bottom (the line of which is still partially visible). This source of water for the industrial process and the engineering associated with bringing it to augment the springs available locally would certainly have been within the capacity of the Romans to have exploited. I think you are underestimating their abilities. Anyway, the Romans were exploiting the surface veins whereas the Victorians were resmelting the smitham-rich sediments so the relative water requirements wouldn't equate.
T
truescrumpy
Guest
Andy Sparrow said:truescrumpy said:whitelackington said:
It is my theory that there will prove to be three Charterhouse on Mendip / Cheddar main trunk routes.
a) The one most people belive in, Blackmoor, Waterwheel, Grebe, Manor, Longwood, Rhino, Charterhouse & G.B. Cavern, Bone Hole, Reservoir Hole, all coming out at Gough's.
b) Tor, Attborough Swallet, Wigmore Swallet, Bowery Corner Swallet, mostly coming out via a different trunk route also at Gough's, but some of it may leak elsewhere for example Rodney Stoke Rising.
c) Pintree Pot, Ubley Warren Swallet/Nettle, Cow Hole, Upper Flood Swallet and anything draining into The Rakes, this will prove to be a third and independant main trunk route but coming out where, Perhaps Rodney Stoke, perhaps Axbridge or probably Gough's.
I like your idea to this theory, as in honesty all, it does make sense. 8)
Why? Maybe you can explain why it makes sense?
Ok I try explain this in plain English :alien:
On the quotes of Whitelackington:
a) I hope we all agree on that one!!!!!!!!!!!! 8)
b) As it's been proved that the stream connects to Gough, there is also no reason why it didn't connect to Rodney Stoke even possibity at an earlier stage in the past through a main trunk route. :doubt:
c) As it is most likely to connect to Gough's, we have to remember that UF is shallow cave and is pointing South, directly South of that point is ...... Yes Rodney Stoke, which also is quite high up against the likes of Gough's
So it does look like 3 trunk routes connecting into 1 main route somewhere along the line. Anyhow nothing been proved or disproved yet :chair:
whitelackington said:
Make your mind up Mick! You can't hedge your bets like this!!! :thumbsdown:
In twenty years time you'll be posting messages saying you always knew it would go to Cheddar. And if it goes to Rodney Stoke instead, in twenty years time you'll be posting messages saying you always knew it wouldn't go to Cheddar.
You need to do a dye test. I'll make a case for MCG to pay the cost!
Peter Burgess said:
Then you wouldnt have got very far in Upper Flood as there were no holes, draughts, nor any water sinking/emerging for umpteen years until Midnight Passage was entered in the 1980's. A way had to be blasted through solid calcite which completley filled the passage.
whitelackington said:
I am 99% sure the site of the Roman dam is known, but I would have to search for the reference.
Lack of water in Velvet Bottom is a fair point, Whitelackington. But I am not sure the Romans would have needed a major supply. In Roman times, a lot of the lead ore would have been easily won, being concentrated near the surface. They would take the easy pickings. Their need for machinery would be not be great - they would have used human labour, either employed or enslaved.
cap n chris
Well-known member
Poor Whitelackington: how many versions of his name are there on this forum now?
T
truescrumpy
Guest
i thought at the end of West Passage, it is slighty turning South, sorry if i said the wrong quote.
I was also under the impression from diggers as well as myself that we try and gain into the direction of whichever the nearest resurgance happens to be - Gough's, Wookey, Rodney Stoke :ras:
Whitelackigton maybe wrong sometimes but I say this... the quotes and questions he put on this forum ...it does help to be open mind
I was also under the impression from diggers as well as myself that we try and gain into the direction of whichever the nearest resurgance happens to be - Gough's, Wookey, Rodney Stoke :ras:
Whitelackigton maybe wrong sometimes but I say this... the quotes and questions he put on this forum ...it does help to be open mind
truescrumpy said:
Sorry truescrumpy, I didnt mean to dis what you were saying. I meant the general trend is west, but it could go anywhere next! The first big breakthrough was generally SE. Who knows what will happen next?
WL does ask pertinent questions - I just like to argue with him to wind him up (he knows me)
Peter Burgess
New member
Well, la-di-da, bully for you then.
I'm just jealous. 