Covid 19
- Thread starter cap n chris
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royfellows
Well-known member
I have just had my jab, I consider myself lucky to have the Oxford one which i hear good things about. It was very local, actually the same hall where I train with a karate club. Of course i was very excited and laughing and telling them all about it. I think i managed to make a bit of a nuisance of myself. I asked how i recharge the batteries on the Bill Gates microchip.
People don't forget me easily!
People don't forget me easily!
pwhole
Well-known member
Well it's now fact - obesity is the biggest cause of Covid death after old age, worldwide, adjusted for everything - not that it should come as any surprise really, as a larger body means smaller lungs, relatively - and that's just the baseline problem, never mind the lack of exercise, etc.:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/mar/03/covid-deaths-high-in-countries-with-more-overweight-people-says-report
The risks rise with increasing overweight. An analysis of the data seen by the Guardian shows that in the UK, where almost 64% of adults are overweight or obese, nearly 20% of Covid patients in intensive care are of normal weight, 32% are overweight and 48% are obese. In the USA, where adult overweight and obesity is at 68%, 12% of Covid patients in intensive care have normal weight, 24% are overweight and 64% are obese.
The results allow for age and are not skewed by poor data from some countries, said Lobstein. Deaths tend to be reported accurately even if hospitalisations are not. They adjusted for GDP and found income levels did not play a part either. ?There are rich countries with low levels of overweight, like Japan and South Korea, and they have very low Covid death rates. Equally, there are lower-income countries like South Africa and Brazil, where overweight is now affecting more than half the population, where we see high Covid-19 death rates,? he said.
?We now know that an overweight population is the next pandemic waiting to happen,? said Lobstein.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/mar/03/covid-deaths-high-in-countries-with-more-overweight-people-says-report
The risks rise with increasing overweight. An analysis of the data seen by the Guardian shows that in the UK, where almost 64% of adults are overweight or obese, nearly 20% of Covid patients in intensive care are of normal weight, 32% are overweight and 48% are obese. In the USA, where adult overweight and obesity is at 68%, 12% of Covid patients in intensive care have normal weight, 24% are overweight and 64% are obese.
The results allow for age and are not skewed by poor data from some countries, said Lobstein. Deaths tend to be reported accurately even if hospitalisations are not. They adjusted for GDP and found income levels did not play a part either. ?There are rich countries with low levels of overweight, like Japan and South Korea, and they have very low Covid death rates. Equally, there are lower-income countries like South Africa and Brazil, where overweight is now affecting more than half the population, where we see high Covid-19 death rates,? he said.
?We now know that an overweight population is the next pandemic waiting to happen,? said Lobstein.
Speleofish
Active member
The overweight thing is quite complex. You're right that if you're overweight you have less lung capacity - not only a smaller ratio of lungs to body mass but, probably more importantly, a large belly and thicker chest wall makes breathing less efficient. In addition, fat tissue isn't just inert excess weight - it has effects on inflammation and immunity which are bad for you. These hold true in all respiratory infections not just Covid, which makes the outcomes of obese patients in ICU worse than more streamlined patients (it's also much harder to give them the nursing care and physiotherapy they require).
Finally, although the study you quote in the Guardian should have tried to eliminate the effect of high blood pressure and type 2 diabetes from its analysis, it's very hard to do this completely so there may be a contribution from risk factors like these that are linked to obesity.
Finally, although the study you quote in the Guardian should have tried to eliminate the effect of high blood pressure and type 2 diabetes from its analysis, it's very hard to do this completely so there may be a contribution from risk factors like these that are linked to obesity.
Alex
Well-known member
So rather than lockdowns, they should just put everyone on a treadmill and let us go caving then? I know I have put on a few pounds in lock-down, lock-down must be having the opposite effect on obesity i.e. making things a lot worse. I must admit, it's hard to motivate yourself to exercise with the stay local rule in place. Done everything seen everything locally, the rules are counterproductive (not least as it makes local places very busy) I hope the gov stick to their promise of releasing that rule come 29th of March.
pwhole
Well-known member
Alex said:
I've set myself a survey project or two to do, which gets me out of the house every day, for several hours, gives me loads of exercise and is producing very useful information - for me at the moment, but hopefully an industrial archaeologist attached to Sheffield Council may be interested eventually. I'm only doing what I would do if I were looking for caves or mines, and I'm getting better all the time - I found a new coal seam (for me) on Tues. I'm meeting a mate in a couple of hours in the woods to attempt some drone footage of a particularly difficult but exciting spot. I never notice the exercise as it's an inherent part of the work. I don't drive (as in, I've never had a driving lesson), and it's a 3km walk just to get there, all uphill - I usually do about 8km a day on this work, and a lot of it is clambering through brambles on very steep slopes etc., so it's a full workout - though I do thirty sit-ups when I get home just in case it was only my legs that got some. I'm no spring chicken, so it can be done! Don't you live in the countryside anyway?
But I can't get bored with going here, really:
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Oceanrower
Active member
Alex said:
There is NO stay local rule if travelling for exercise. It is guidance and is not mentioned in the legislation whatsoever.
As has been confirmed by the College of Policing.
Alex
Well-known member
I am over half way through surveying the local mines (2.5 miles, over a big hill), I suspect I have done 60% but my partner has had enough of it lol, and I don't fancy finishing it off on my own
I don't have a disto x just a compass clino and it would be very difficult to solo survey it and the place is loose, I would rather not be on my own in there, I feel safer in Mossdale lol.I can't go out during the day, except weekend thanks to work, though it does not stop me posting on UKCaving lol.
PeteHall
Moderator
NewStuff said:
And here we go with the ridiculous comparisons again...
Jumping off a tall building without a parachute = almost certain death. possible death of someone you land on. public nuisance due to closed roads. waste of public money on police investigation. waste of public money on coroners investigation
Travelling a (short) distance for exercise to a quieter area than where you live = less personal risk than exercising in the area where you live. less risk to others than exercising where you live. no public inconvenience. no public cost.
Oceanrower
Active member
PeteHall said:NewStuff said:
And here we go with the ridiculous comparisons again...
Jumping off a tall building without a parachute = almost certain death. possible death of someone you land on. public nuisance due to closed roads. waste of public money on police investigation. waste of public money on coroners investigation
Travelling a (short) distance for exercise to a quieter area than where you live = less personal risk than exercising in the area where you live. less risk to others than exercising where you live. no public inconvenience. no public cost.
At last. A policeman who understands the law...
https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/local-news/yorkshire-police-boss-tells-people-19960364.amp?__twitter_impression=true
We multitask. We go caving then go to the supermarket (nearest is 10 miles). One trip, two good reasons.
The supermarket is patently way more risky than the caving. But my wife has now been jabbed, so she does that. Nothing to do with my perceived shopping skills obviously,
The supermarket is patently way more risky than the caving. But my wife has now been jabbed, so she does that. Nothing to do with my perceived shopping skills obviously,
pwhole
Well-known member
Regardless of our local travel conundrums, there's a good chance that if this obesity crisis isn't resolved quickly we are in for a whole shedload of trouble in a few years time, Covid or not. Hospitals will still be rammed with people who are fundamentally so unfit that every illness they get is serious. The situation is disproportionately affecting the poorer segments of society, who will need the most medical care as they're unable to care for themselves due to their poverty and bad education. This latest budget suggested that the government is still trying to brush all these issues under the carpet as the only viable solution (free money for poor to middle-income people) is total anathema to the Conservative party - and most of the British public who are fortunate to not be in that situation. A large proportion of the public think that folks who lost their jobs recently 'deserved to'. If 'consumerism' is to continue, the public need to be able to consume, not go to hospital. If middle-class cancer patients are denied treatment because every hospital is full of spluttering working-class obese people, how will that play out with holding the Red Wall? I haven't heard much from Labour on this either.
62% of British adults are overweight - 69% of US citizens. That's two thirds of the adult population, and loads of kids are too. Vietnam has 18%. We're basically building the conditions to enable the Far East to become the dominant nations simply by not being fat and old, and their current politics dictate that they're running about quite a lot at the moment, so they're only getting fitter.
62% of British adults are overweight - 69% of US citizens. That's two thirds of the adult population, and loads of kids are too. Vietnam has 18%. We're basically building the conditions to enable the Far East to become the dominant nations simply by not being fat and old, and their current politics dictate that they're running about quite a lot at the moment, so they're only getting fitter.
NewStuff
New member
That's quite the fallacy there.PeteHall said:
We get it, you're determined to go out and do what the hell you want, but please have enough of a spine to just bloody say that instead of tying yourself in knots trying to justify it. I certainly won't agree with it, but I will at least respect the decision.
I can understand the media being woefully under-informed, but it is hard to credit that governments and the EU Commission can?t do the maths, or even Google it.
AstraZeneca have had problems with rapid scale up because they are scrabbling around trying to find people who can do it in Europe. It will take a while longer than they hoped. The Serum Institute in India is already cranking out 80 million doses a month of the Oxford vaccine, heading for 100 million - this is because they are the worlds biggest vaccine producer. There is no substitute for actually knowing what you are doing. And in the UK we had nada plant. The new centre at Oxford wasn?t supposed to open until 2022.
The UK contract with AZ is massively behind. They originally were hoping to have 30 million doses by September. They had made 4 million by December. They have yet to deliver 30 million from UK plant I suspect. It doesn?t take much thought to realise that in the summer they thought the UK contract would have been fulfilled long ago. The UK knew this was the case last year and been working constantly to try and help AZ and have bought extra supplies. It would seem the EU Health Commissioner was doing otherwise, and you do wonder what else was occupying her mind all of last year because she didn?t bother to check. The UK knew the EU hadn?t checked because there was an omerta policy. They also rammed through approvals to get the first 20 million batch of Pfizer vaccine before anyone else realised there was a problem.
If I was accountable for vaccine delivery to most of Europe I would have wanted my daily reports from my resident engineers in industry like the the UK has clearly been doing. But maybe that?s just me.
This is an interesting article too:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/28/europes-technocrats-play-into-populist-hands-with-their-bungled-covid-response
AstraZeneca have had problems with rapid scale up because they are scrabbling around trying to find people who can do it in Europe. It will take a while longer than they hoped. The Serum Institute in India is already cranking out 80 million doses a month of the Oxford vaccine, heading for 100 million - this is because they are the worlds biggest vaccine producer. There is no substitute for actually knowing what you are doing. And in the UK we had nada plant. The new centre at Oxford wasn?t supposed to open until 2022.
The UK contract with AZ is massively behind. They originally were hoping to have 30 million doses by September. They had made 4 million by December. They have yet to deliver 30 million from UK plant I suspect. It doesn?t take much thought to realise that in the summer they thought the UK contract would have been fulfilled long ago. The UK knew this was the case last year and been working constantly to try and help AZ and have bought extra supplies. It would seem the EU Health Commissioner was doing otherwise, and you do wonder what else was occupying her mind all of last year because she didn?t bother to check. The UK knew the EU hadn?t checked because there was an omerta policy. They also rammed through approvals to get the first 20 million batch of Pfizer vaccine before anyone else realised there was a problem.
If I was accountable for vaccine delivery to most of Europe I would have wanted my daily reports from my resident engineers in industry like the the UK has clearly been doing. But maybe that?s just me.
This is an interesting article too:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/28/europes-technocrats-play-into-populist-hands-with-their-bungled-covid-response
pwhole
Well-known member
