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Down and up, look-see of Titan?

Cantclimbtom

Active member
Hi all, this is just a very vague question, after any indications of interest (no specific commitment/date) if any of you mine explorer types ever fancied at some undetermined point a "quick" look at Titan. "Just" down-up to have a look-see.

I was toying with idea of a solo trip to keep simple but struggling with logistical info such as booking/keys etc (not basic topo which is easy to Google) and thought going with one or more others might divide and conquer getting info plus be more generally sociable.

Of immediate consideration are: Freehanging rebelay and 3 long prussics, if those are a concern, err to caution.

Don't take the question too seriously, this is just some vague fishing to see if this is something that interests many others here.
 

ChrisJC

Well-known member
I did it, in the down direction only (and exited via Peak Cavern). It is an excellent trip, but I did sh*t myself in Titan itself, even though I never looked up or down!

I know that one 'feed-through' of rope on my stop is about 1meter, so I did that 70 times and then looked about to find myself at pretty much the event horizon. Other than that, eyes shut.

Chris.
 

Brains

Well-known member
Tandem ascent is an option if you are confident, usually used to speed up big alpine climbs. Also reduces the time at the bottom exposed to stone fall ( note the white strike marks at the base!)
Take a really bright lamp so you can look around while catching your breath 😀
 

Fulk

Well-known member
Hi Tom,

Hi all, this is just a very vague question, after any indications of interest (no specific commitment/date) if any of you mine explorer types ever fancied at some undetermined point a "quick" look at Titan. "Just" down-up to have a look-see.

I've done Titan as a 'simple' down-and-up trip, and I'd say it's very worthwhile, even if you don't stray far from the bottom of the pitch, as it's so spectacular.
 

Cantclimbtom

Active member
Thanks everyone!
Not sure when I can get up to the Peak next, but this definitely sounds very tempting indeed for my next trip, probably should think about improving jumaring fitness too (hope it to be enjoyable not a punishment)

Thanks especially to pwhole for info and offer to accompany if dates were good, I may take you up on that!
 

Cantclimbtom

Active member
cavemanmike said:
A pantin is a god send and I would say essential on pitches that size
After years of not quite getting round to it, I tried one for first time last weekend. Why why why hadn't I bought one before?

ChrisJC said:
I did it, in the down direction only (and exited via Peak Cavern). It is an excellent trip, but I did sh*t myself in Titan itself, even though I never looked up or down!

I know that one 'feed-through' of rope on my stop is about 1meter, so I did that 70 times and then looked about to find myself at pretty much the event horizon. Other than that, eyes shut.

Chris.
Ha ha! Yes I have before turned my light to ultra low to help focus only on my immediate surroundings and task. Sometimes you need to do what you need to do. I'm sure everyone's been there more times than we'd like to admit ;)
 

pwhole

Well-known member
We took a 12 year-old down there in 2011 or so, and he went right through the system and out of Peak Cavern, if you need any reassurance. Though he did have his eyes shut for most of the drop, to be fair. But if you were planning to climb back up Titan, a short trip around the Far Sump series is essential first, otherwise it's all pain and no gain :)
 
Titan, tandem ascent and Pantin. All mentioned.
The 3rd (and last) time I tandemed Titan I was the lead climber and towing a full tackle bag.
The 6mm tackle hauling strop decided to join the main 9mm rope in my pantin.
I found it impossible to sort it out on my own, and my companion on the rope below had to come up just below me and push the bag up each time I took a step.
It would have been a lot quicker if we had done the pitch one at a time!

Cantclimbtom, I think you are into mining, so I am sure you will appreciate the repair work that was done on the entrance shaft a few years ago.
Looking at it also provides a good reason for having a rest.
 

pwhole

Well-known member
Haha, yes, I was sat at the bottom of the entrance shaft on that trip freezing my nuts off waiting for you both to get up. I remember at the time wondering if it was a good idea. Though at least we know Mammut 9mm can take it :)
 

Fulk

Well-known member
The 6mm tackle hauling strop decided to join the main 9mm rope in my pantin.
I found it impossible to sort it out on my own, and my companion on the rope below had to come up just below me and push the bag up each time I took a step.

Hmmm, that?s an interesting scenario, CF; the fact that your friend was able to push the bag up implies that the pantin wasn?t immovably jammed and was capable of being moved up the rope, in which case it seems surprising that it wasn?t possible for him/her to undo the pantin?s cam.
 

paul

Moderator
Also worth bearing in mind it helps if you know the route to the Peak Cavern exit if you decide on a through trip going down Titan and out of Peak Cavern...
 

Cantclimbtom

Active member
Chocolate fireguard said:
Titan, tandem ascent and Pantin. All mentioned.
The 3rd (and last) time I tandemed Titan I was the lead climber and towing a full tackle bag.
The 6mm tackle hauling strop decided to join the main 9mm rope in my pantin.
I found it impossible to sort it out on my own, and my companion on the rope below had to come up just below me and push the bag up each time I took a step.
It would have been a lot quicker if we had done the pitch one at a time!

Cantclimbtom, I think you are into mining, so I am sure you will appreciate the repair work that was done on the entrance shaft a few years ago.
Looking at it also provides a good reason for having a rest.
Yes I am always impressed by and enjoy mines (although to be clear, I am no seasoned expert!) I will take a look at the repairs, is that the same as the "lined section" I saw on a Youtube in the middle (?) of P1. To be honest I am completely gob-smacked by all of the digging involved, just reading the Wikipedia page on the boulder chokes shaft digging, initial aiding up etc I am just astonished at the effort. By the time someone has jugged up that far, they probably benefit from examining the repair for a while (not resting, honest!) :)
 

Cantclimbtom

Active member
pwhole said:
We took a 12 year-old down there in 2011 or so, and he went right through the system and out of Peak Cavern, if you need any reassurance. Though he did have his eyes shut for most of the drop, to be fair. But if you were planning to climb back up Titan, a short trip around the Far Sump series is essential first, otherwise it's all pain and no gain :)
Looking at YouTube, I'm impressed by not just your account of accompanying a 12year old, but seeing other examples like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JY_dvjWD-ig
Very pleased that some kids are still getting a taste of adventure since this stuff seems increasingly frowned upon, or at least what is considered by many as acceptable adventure is becoming increasingly less adventurous :(

Unfortunately my eldest (son, 14) is really not keen on anything like this as it doesn't have a touch screen. For example I managed the first 1/2 of Dinorwig "Snakes, ladders and Tunnels" with him last summer as an adventurous jolly - up the snake (I had to 1:3 haul him :( ), down little ab, short squeeze+tunnel then ladders to the miners' canteen. But it all was proving too much for him so we walked down from there rather than go to lost world. The great ladder of Mordor would have given him a nervous breakdown, so decided best not. Definitely can't consider Titan with him that's for sure! But greatest respect to the kids (and their parents) who do!
 

Cantclimbtom

Active member
paul said:
Also worth bearing in mind it helps if you know the route to the Peak Cavern exit if you decide on a through trip going down Titan and out of Peak Cavern...
Yes a through trip is (in my opinion) the gold-standard for Jollies. You feel you've made a journey, you maybe see more.

I'm very concerned that:
1) I have zero knowledge of peak caves or the route (currently)
2)  the 3rd pitch would need to pull-through for that to work and the second pitch rigged in a way the rope could be hauled up from the top of pitch2, that'd mean that only pitch 1 would need repeating and jugging. A quick look at YouTube videos it doesn't suitable as a pull-through route! At least not an obvious candidate
How have people done this in the past, was it as an exchange trip with others keen to jug up Titan (or did it depend on some of the party making an up-down for the benefit of the others?
 

ChrisJC

Well-known member
When we did the Titan to Peak through trip, we arranged a guide. I think we would have found our way, but it was much easier with a guide.

We left Titan rigged, with the intention of going back the next day to retrieve the ropes. However somebody else retrieved them for us and brought them back to the TSG where we were staying. I for one was very grateful!

Chris.
 

Paul Marvin

Member
Cantclimbtom said:
paul said:
Also worth bearing in mind it helps if you know the route to the Peak Cavern exit if you decide on a through trip going down Titan and out of Peak Cavern...
Yes a through trip is (in my opinion) the gold-standard for Jollies. You feel you've made a journey, you maybe see more.

I'm very concerned that:
1) I have zero knowledge of peak caves or the route (currently)
2)  the 3rd pitch would need to pull-through for that to work and the second pitch rigged in a way the rope could be hauled up from the top of pitch2, that'd mean that only pitch 1 would need repeating and jugging. A quick look at YouTube videos it doesn't suitable as a pull-through route! At least not an obvious candidate
How have people done this in the past, was it as an exchange trip with others keen to jug up Titan (or did it depend on some of the party making an up-down for the benefit of the others?

Sounds like somebody is getting the cave bug  :LOL:
 
Cantclimbtom said:
paul said:
Also worth bearing in mind it helps if you know the route to the Peak Cavern exit if you decide on a through trip going down Titan and out of Peak Cavern...
Yes a through trip is (in my opinion) the gold-standard for Jollies. You feel you've made a journey, you maybe see more.

I'm very concerned that:
1) I have zero knowledge of peak caves or the route (currently)
2)  the 3rd pitch would need to pull-through for that to work and the second pitch rigged in a way the rope could be hauled up from the top of pitch2, that'd mean that only pitch 1 would need repeating and jugging. A quick look at YouTube videos it doesn't suitable as a pull-through route! At least not an obvious candidate
How have people done this in the past, was it as an exchange trip with others keen to jug up Titan (or did it depend on some of the party making an up-down for the benefit of the others?
Titan can be done as a pull through - I imagine it has been done several times by now - but it needs careful thought and preparation.
The pitches are all long enough to give problems with ropes twisting together, although if you have a non-caving friend on the surface the entrance pitch can be sorted. And it's surprising how much weight is needed to start pulling down on a pitch as long as pitch 2.
The bit from the bottom of pitch 2, down the slope and over the edge to the belays at the top of pitch 3 needs an extra bit of rope.
Probably best left until you have been down a few times.
As well as avoiding getting lost there is the need to know that the bit just before the bottom of JH is not sumped.

I think most people who do the through trip are resigned to some of the party going back down at least to the top of pitch 3 to retrieve the ropes.
It's worth knowing that loose rope at the bottom of that pitch can get caught in the boulders, making it necessary to do the lot!
 

pwhole

Well-known member
Exchange trips are usually the way to retrieve the ropes, or going back the next day, as Chris said - or even the same day. Done that a few times but it's really depressing going down to climb back up. At least you don't have to go right to the bottom! Small mercies...

I know the route out, so you'd be fine if I was there. However, if it's a very wet period, the connection passage beteen Far Sump Extensions and the bottom of Leviathan can sump, meaning a bale-out, or more likely, turning back and going back up Titan. So only plan a through-trip when you know it'll be doable! You can ask us locals for up-to-date info.

EDIT - we posted some info simultaneously :)
 
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