Draenen New Entrances
- Thread starter rhychydwr1
- Start date
alastairgott
Well-known member
Paranoid conspiracy! No4 of many?
Ship-badger
Member
NewStuff
New member
Minion said:The photos uploaded to Facebook by Martyn Farr in the last day or so, along with a comment from one of the PDCMG committee are very telling.
PDCMG meeting on Sunday should be interesting....
I very much doubt, given previous trends, They care.
I suspect this is a fairly close re-enactment of the PDCMG when informed that most other cavers thought it was a bad idea to concrete up an entrance.
Oh, the PDCMG will care alright but whether they will care enough to embrace the winds of change is another matter entirely. Comments already made in public, along with the vibe I have been picking up from other quarters, are not encouraging.
Here are some hard facts to help them on their way:
One of the stated aims in the PDCMG Constitution is "To control access to Ogof Draenen", another is "To encourage a free exchange of information". It is abundantly clear that they have failed dismally on both counts. They have not been able to actually "control" access since August 2009 and current events are proving that they have absolutely no idea what is happening within either the cave system itself or its environs. In recent correspondence with one of the premier Welsh cave diggers of his generation, he said to me:
"Simply blocking the entrance to any cave is clearly not acceptable. In any case, the PDCMG have no idea what is going on, they don't even know the true length of Ogof Draenen as they are so far out of touch with what has been found over the last few years. I would never share any information with this group, they are a clique in the truest sense of the word. They have their heads stuck so far up each other's backsides, it is hardly surprising what comes out of their mouths when they try to speak!"
The "Single Entrance Policy" the PDCMG have held so dear for so long is lying on the ground in tatters and is finished. Yes, it may still be there in theory but it will never exist in real terms ever again. If they concrete up and close all the other entrances currently open, some more will just be found to replace them and this will simply carry on, ad infinitum.
Back in 1994, when the first exciting discoveries were made, Ogof Draenen did indeed possess a single entrance. This ceased to be the case once the Second (Nunnery) Entrance was discovered but the PDCMG could not tolerate this and it was concreted shut in 1999. Had they been willing to compromise at this point (or again ten years later when we requested that it be reopened), they would have had two entrances. They did not and, as a direct result, Drws Cefn was connected to the main system in 2009 to give a third entrance. Once again, they refused to negotiate even one iota and have been trying their utmost to close Drws for the last eight years. Had they seen sense they could have settled for three entrances but they chose not to do so. So that leaves us precisely where we are today, with as many entrances as there might be (nobody seems to know for sure!). Well, the pattern is stunningly clear, the lessons etched in history do not lie. Will the PDCMG finally open their eyes and act accordingly?
We shall see.
Here are some hard facts to help them on their way:
One of the stated aims in the PDCMG Constitution is "To control access to Ogof Draenen", another is "To encourage a free exchange of information". It is abundantly clear that they have failed dismally on both counts. They have not been able to actually "control" access since August 2009 and current events are proving that they have absolutely no idea what is happening within either the cave system itself or its environs. In recent correspondence with one of the premier Welsh cave diggers of his generation, he said to me:
"Simply blocking the entrance to any cave is clearly not acceptable. In any case, the PDCMG have no idea what is going on, they don't even know the true length of Ogof Draenen as they are so far out of touch with what has been found over the last few years. I would never share any information with this group, they are a clique in the truest sense of the word. They have their heads stuck so far up each other's backsides, it is hardly surprising what comes out of their mouths when they try to speak!"
The "Single Entrance Policy" the PDCMG have held so dear for so long is lying on the ground in tatters and is finished. Yes, it may still be there in theory but it will never exist in real terms ever again. If they concrete up and close all the other entrances currently open, some more will just be found to replace them and this will simply carry on, ad infinitum.
Back in 1994, when the first exciting discoveries were made, Ogof Draenen did indeed possess a single entrance. This ceased to be the case once the Second (Nunnery) Entrance was discovered but the PDCMG could not tolerate this and it was concreted shut in 1999. Had they been willing to compromise at this point (or again ten years later when we requested that it be reopened), they would have had two entrances. They did not and, as a direct result, Drws Cefn was connected to the main system in 2009 to give a third entrance. Once again, they refused to negotiate even one iota and have been trying their utmost to close Drws for the last eight years. Had they seen sense they could have settled for three entrances but they chose not to do so. So that leaves us precisely where we are today, with as many entrances as there might be (nobody seems to know for sure!). Well, the pattern is stunningly clear, the lessons etched in history do not lie. Will the PDCMG finally open their eyes and act accordingly?
We shall see.
danthecavingman
Member
How's the survey coming on? Has the system been significantly extended in the last few years and have new entrances made progression beyond the previous limits more feasible?
JohnMCooper
Member
John S,
Keep up the good work.
Keep up the good work.
Hi Dan,
I would love to be in a position to answer your questions regarding the current exploration of the system but unfortunately (as I am sure you will understand) this is not the case at the present time.
Maybe, just maybe, things might begin to change a little after the meeting tomorrow, but who can tell?
I would love to be in a position to answer your questions regarding the current exploration of the system but unfortunately (as I am sure you will understand) this is not the case at the present time.
Maybe, just maybe, things might begin to change a little after the meeting tomorrow, but who can tell?
Recent events in relation to the subject of this thread have certainly highlighted the effectiveness of social media in the dissemination of rapidly breaking news.
The interest generated by this is quite understandable, particularly amongst South Wales based cavers. However, it is extremely important at the present time that people act, and are seen to be acting, in a responsible manner. In particular, it is absolutely vital any caves already covered over remain that way in order to protect livestock and the general public: standard practice everywhere but more important than ever now. So, if you remove covers of any description in order to enter any cave please be sure to replace them precisely as you found them when you leave (and try to keep it covered as best you can while you are down there). It would be a crying shame for all the fantastic efforts of the original explorers to go to waste purely as a result of carelessness shown by other cavers.
Please respect any equipment you find in situ and use it purely at your own risk: it is worth bearing in mind that it might not have been looked after quite as well as your own!
Don't forget that any recent discoveries will be intrinsically more unstable in nature than you might be used to, so be careful what you touch: it may not be as solid as first appears. Less experienced cavers should definitely keep well away!
Finally, I attended the PDCMG meeting yesterday (my first for eight years!) and it was obvious that this is indeed a somewhat difficult time for them. I will give a fuller report in due course.
The interest generated by this is quite understandable, particularly amongst South Wales based cavers. However, it is extremely important at the present time that people act, and are seen to be acting, in a responsible manner. In particular, it is absolutely vital any caves already covered over remain that way in order to protect livestock and the general public: standard practice everywhere but more important than ever now. So, if you remove covers of any description in order to enter any cave please be sure to replace them precisely as you found them when you leave (and try to keep it covered as best you can while you are down there). It would be a crying shame for all the fantastic efforts of the original explorers to go to waste purely as a result of carelessness shown by other cavers.
Please respect any equipment you find in situ and use it purely at your own risk: it is worth bearing in mind that it might not have been looked after quite as well as your own!
Don't forget that any recent discoveries will be intrinsically more unstable in nature than you might be used to, so be careful what you touch: it may not be as solid as first appears. Less experienced cavers should definitely keep well away!
Finally, I attended the PDCMG meeting yesterday (my first for eight years!) and it was obvious that this is indeed a somewhat difficult time for them. I will give a fuller report in due course.
rhychydwr1
Active member
Can't wait for the full report
rhychydwr1
Active member
What about Spanish then?
The Old Ruminator
Well-known member
rhychydwr1 said:
Cueva de Draenan tiene un buen n?mero de entradas potenciales
