Famous and Fearless bullshit

[graham]

But I do have a TV set.

You're weird!

 

[ogof addict]

i happily admit i am a bit weird  as are most cavers i have met, thats why i like them.

if it was changed to SOME cavers are weird, that may be closer to the truth, the rest of the info/commentary sounding like utter bollox

 

[Slug]

My experience with Talkback Thames (Great British Railway Journeys)  last year was quite the opposite. They were anxious to get the facts right, and reliably used the historical information provided. This meant dropping one or two "story lines" they had hoped to use. They were prone to coming to the wrong conclusions once or twice, though.

There is patently a difference in approach between "reality" TV and factual documentaries. I use the word "reality" very reluctantly.

Watched it last night on line, well the underground bit at least. I found it quite well made, well presented, and interesting, unlike that C4 shite...... :yucky:

It'll be on line on the BBC i-player until 20th Jan 2011.

 

[cap n chris]

Perhaps any film production company wishing to combine any celebrity with any cave should be vetoed from now on.

In straitened times, however, I suspect that money will continue to talk (to someone prepared to respond) and the client will get what the client wants. Therefore any representations made to the Ombudsman would ultimately result in a caver-versus-caver tussle as the TV company would rebut negative accusations by the expedient of claiming they employed the services of professional advisers and therefore based their editorial upon a sound platform but with additional spin or "artistic" flair as is the long-standing tradition with mainstream media (or othersuch suitably embroidered defence).

I haven't watched it (yet), btw, as it's a TV thing and my jaundiced, prejudiced and cynical view is that TV, generally, is total shite.

 

[Peter Burgess]

My experience with Talkback Thames (Great British Railway Journeys)  last year was quite the opposite. They were anxious to get the facts right, and reliably used the historical information provided. This meant dropping one or two "story lines" they had hoped to use. They were prone to coming to the wrong conclusions once or twice, though.

There is patently a difference in approach between "reality" TV and factual documentaries. I use the word "reality" very reluctantly.

Watched it last night on line, well the underground bit at least. I found it quite well made, well presented, and interesting, unlike that C4 shite...... :yucky:

It'll be on line on the BBC i-player until 20th Jan 2011.

I'm thinking of complaining to OFCOM about the dreadful use of archive photos of mines in the wrong geological formation. 

 

[Andy Sparrow]

Therefore any representations made to the Ombudsman would ultimately result in a caver-versus-caver tussle as the TV company would rebut negative accusations by the expedient of claiming they employed the services of professional advisers and therefore based their editorial upon a sound platform but with additional spin or "artistic" flair as is the long-standing tradition with mainstream media (or othersuch suitably embroidered defence).

Ken told me about the filming session for this.  The director would not even go down the cave.  Upon their exit they shoot some footage of Ken answering some questions (not broadcast).  Apparently the director said -  "I'll tell you what to say and you say it in your own words".  He then told Ken to say that this was one of the most dangeros potholes in Britain.  Ken complained that it wasn't a pothole but a cave.  The director told him to call it a pothole 'cause "that's what the public want".

I think in this case the  'professional adviser' would be first in the queue to complain of misrepresentation. 

 

[graham]

Perhaps any film production company wishing to combine any celebrity with any cave should be vetoed from now on.

In straitened times, however, I suspect that money will continue to talk (to someone prepared to respond) and the client will get what the client wants.

Not always. A production company, last year, wanted us to bring fragile human remains from our museum, in Bristol, to be filmed in a car park near the cave where they were found, as they  were bored with having to only film such stuffoin museum premises.

We said "no". It didn't get filmed. That's fine.

 

[tony from suffolk]

Having had the misfortune to be involved with TV programs in the past, I'm afraid you're wasting your time complaining. You'll get an acknowledgement along the lines of "Thank you for your interest in such-and-such a program, we value your input etc. etc."

Sad to tell but it's only until you see a program that's something you actually know about when you begin to realise there may be more topics that are subject to similar treatment. In my experience, for "some" read "almost all".

With this in mind, when did you last see an apology or correction for blatantly untrue broadcast content? Sorry, but it's entertainment, not documentary.

 

[owd git]

one way of 'fixing' t.v. celeb's is to hire them a duff hen to race
Ask Paddy 'n' Rory. :tease:
I suppose the caving equivalent would be to let them film some of our mud here in Derbyshire
Owd Git,

 

[cap n chris]

Ken told me about the filming session for this.  The director would not even go down the cave.  Upon their exit they shoot some footage of Ken answering some questions (not broadcast).  Apparently the director said -  "I'll tell you what to say and you say it in your own words".  He then told Ken to say that this was one of the most dangeros potholes in Britain.  Ken complained that it wasn't a pothole but a cave.  The director told him to call it a pothole 'cause "that's what the public want".

I think in this case the  'professional adviser' would be first in the queue to complain of misrepresentation.

Blinkin' flippers. Indeed.

Sounds like they didn't really want or need an advisor/caver and then their entire wishlist could have been fulfilled in one strike insofar as they could have engaged in "Do It Yourself Brain Surgery" and invented their own potential misadventure on the spot by simply dismissing Ken and his services and jollying off underground with a candle and high hopes.

 

[anfieldman]

Ken told me about the filming session for this.  The director would not even go down the cave.  Upon their exit they shoot some footage of Ken answering some questions (not broadcast).  Apparently the director said -  "I'll tell you what to say and you say it in your own words".  He then told Ken to say that this was one of the most dangeros potholes in Britain.  Ken complained that it wasn't a pothole but a cave.  The director told him to call it a pothole 'cause "that's what the public want".

I think in this case the  'professional adviser' would be first in the queue to complain of misrepresentation.

Blinkin' flippers. Indeed.

Sounds like they didn't really want or need an advisor/caver and then their entire wishlist could have been fulfilled in one strike insofar as they could have engaged in "Do It Yourself Brain Surgery" and invented their own potential misadventure on the spot by simply dismissing Ken and his services and jollying off underground with a candle and high hopes.

Andy is quite right on this one. That is exactly what Ken told me except he did say that the director went into Swildons as far as where the boulders have moved in the entrance then he got all scared and made a swift exit.
I feel sorry for Ken as he obviously wanted the filming to be done accurately and in an entertaining way but he was stitched up by the way it was edited. Manipulative bast*rds!

 

[Peter Burgess]

Was this programme produced by Princess Productions Limited?

 

[darren]

Diden't anyone watch the rest of the program, or even the trailer in the weeks before?

Of course the caving bit was shit and unrealistic. It was in keeping with the rest of the series. The bit about the dangers involved in laying down on skateboards and racing slowly down hill was particularly good. Of course I cannot properly compare this bit with any other bit as I stopped watching immediately afterwards, 10 minutes was enough to fully realize the level of the show.

The really worrying thing is anyone on here expected it to be otherwise. That 'caving' clip had as much to do with caving as Eastenders has to do with life in London.

Get some perspective :chair: :chair:

 

[bren]

put it into context  - did you see the mini bikes they were "racing" they were doing all of 15mph.look at what they were doing above ground .defo a croc but really the people on this forum can steer people who were scared by the properganda in the right direction.The whole program whether about caving or extreme sports is a joke and cavers are not the only casualty theyve made a mockery of lots of active/extreme sports.Vote with your feet and ignore the media interpritation and their trite program. I am quite a new caver but wise enough to a) steer idiots away from the sport and b) suport genuine people who are scared and need to belay the fears installed in them by people who dont have the first clue what we do and more importantly Why we do it.F*** famous n fearless and support anyone who off the back of the programme comes to our community.Thats my 2penith.... :spank:

 

[Peter Burgess]

This programme is sparking controversy in many circles......

http://www.thespoof.com/news/spoof.cfm?headline=s4i89230

 

[Peter Burgess]

Another rave review! http://www.guardian.co.uk/tv-and-radio/tvandradioblog/2011/jan/04/famous-and-fearless

 

[bren]

like it darren!!

 

[Hughie]

Diden't anyone watch the rest of the program, or even the trailer in the weeks before?

Of course the caving bit was shit and unrealistic. It was in keeping with the rest of the series. The bit about the dangers involved in laying down on skateboards and racing slowly down hill was particularly good. Of course I cannot properly compare this bit with any other bit as I stopped watching immediately afterwards, 10 minutes was enough to fully realize the level of the show.

The really worrying thing is anyone on here expected it to be otherwise. That 'caving' clip had as much to do with caving as Eastenders has to do with life in London.

Get some perspective :chair: :chair:

Spot on, Mr Drum  .

 

[Elaine]

I don't really agree. I don't think medias like television (that have so much impact on how people think) should portray things in any way they chose. If it isn't meant to be fiction then they ought to be making an effort to get it right. Doesn't sound like they made much effort at all here. I mean "Dartmoor"!! How much more wrong could you get and that was just the first word!
Eastenders is fiction. (Isn't it?)

 

[cap n chris]

Is that the programme where a young(ish) and SLIM  Rich West was filmed in the MRO store explaining what happens on a call out , and Roger Dors answers the phone, informs the usual suspects, who firstly, down their beers, before setting off, 

Would be great to see that. Anyone got a recording they can get on to Youtube??

Finally!.....

http://youtu.be/OjH6lqcGTDY