CNCC
Well-known member
Hello all
The following is an email I have just sent out to all CNCC full member clubs. However, I am conscious that sadly only a small proportion of northern clubs are actually CNCC full members and the following is something that would benefit from widest possible input by BCA member clubs and individuals. Note that all regional councils have been asked to gather opinion from their members on this, so if you belong to another regional council then you should be receiving a similar communication from them in due course.
The British Caving Association are currently looking at additional ways they can support and provide membership benefits to cavers, particularly given their budgetary surplus over recent years.
One of the possibilities that has been raised, and which has received quite a bit of positivity, is the BCA providing personal accident (death and disability) insurance as a benefit of membership, as well as their existing public liability insurance. As with the public liability insurance, this must be given as a benefit of membership to all BCA members; there cannot be an ?opt in/out? option as the BCA cannot sell insurance and we have been informed that this means the benefit must be applied to all full members of the BCA regardless of whether it is actually wanted by that individual.
The BCA Insurance manager, Howard Jones, has been working with the BCA?s insurers and identified a group policy that could be provided at an annual cost of ?13000. Howard proposes that this could be funded through BCA surplus, rather than by increasing membership fees.
It is worth bearing in mind that should the situation change in the future and funding of this becomes financially unviable (either due to increased insurance premium, e.g. following claims, or reduced BCA surplus), the decision to continue include this as a membership benefit would be reviewed on a year by year basis.
Please find details below provided by Howard for consideration by all BCA members. Regional Councils and constituent bodies have been asked to canvass opinion and feedback on whether this would be a membership benefit people would want, and whether they would be happy for ?13000 of BCA money to be spent annually providing this membership benefit. It is worth noting that Howard is also the BCA treasurer, so we can be confident that this has been fully costed.
I am happy to collect feedback on behalf of northern clubs; I would appreciate it if you could please discuss this with your members and feed back to me the general feeling amongst your clubs; roughly what proportion of your membership do you think would support this?
If I could get feedback in time for the CNCC Committee meeting on 22nd June, that would be good.
At the moment the BCA is looking for an ?indicative opinion? to give an idea of whether there is appetite for this from the members, so all feedback is appreciated.
From my personal perspective, I think the BCA is absolutely right to be looking at what additional benefits it can provide for members (as well as what additional it can do for British Caving) using the funds it has available, and Howard has done an excellent job at coming up with this as an option. The question is whether this is something that enough members would actually want.
Please discuss in your clubs and feed back to me your thoughts (secretary[at]cncc.org.uk), which I will pass onto the BCA as the indicative feeling of northern cavers. If anyone has any questions you can contact Howard directly (contact details on BCA website).
Kind regards
Matt Ewles
Secretary, Council of Northern Caving Clubs
The following notes are from Howard Jones, BCA Insurance Manager:
Personal accident (Death and disability) insurance is one of those polices which is very expensive to take out as an individual (especially as a caver) but much cheaper as a group. I asked Howdens to look at a policy for BCA members to go on top of the liability policy already in place as a member benefit. They have advised there is a policy available at a cost of ?2.50 for a caver and ?0.34 for a non-caver which in the event of death or disability due to a caving event would pay out ?50k. Given our current membership the cost would be some ?13,000, less than our surplus in each of the last 2 years. A caving event is defined as the walk to and from the cave (or mine) and the trip underground. Hence the drive to the cave would not be covered.
As well as Death, the following expenses would be covered:
? Accident Medical Expenses: ?2,500
? Coma Benefit: ?50 per full 24 hours up to a maximum of 104 weeks
? Convalescence: ?200 or ?100 for Insured Persons above the age of 70
? Counselling: ?250 up to a maximum of ?5,000 per Insured Person
? Funeral Expenses: ?10,000
? Hospitalisation: ?50 per full 24 hours up to a maximum of 52 weeks.
? Paralysis: Up to ?50,000
If our members don?t have such cover that would respond in the event of a caving incident, this is a significant and cheap member benefit.
Please note this is a proposed member benefit and as such it all or nothing, there is no opt out. The cost of ?13K per annum can be funded in various ways: out of the current surplus (?20k in the last few years), reducing reserves, or increasing subscriptions by the amount of the policy (?2.50 per person).
Proposal: To take out this policy as a member benefit and fund from current surplus.
The following is an email I have just sent out to all CNCC full member clubs. However, I am conscious that sadly only a small proportion of northern clubs are actually CNCC full members and the following is something that would benefit from widest possible input by BCA member clubs and individuals. Note that all regional councils have been asked to gather opinion from their members on this, so if you belong to another regional council then you should be receiving a similar communication from them in due course.
The British Caving Association are currently looking at additional ways they can support and provide membership benefits to cavers, particularly given their budgetary surplus over recent years.
One of the possibilities that has been raised, and which has received quite a bit of positivity, is the BCA providing personal accident (death and disability) insurance as a benefit of membership, as well as their existing public liability insurance. As with the public liability insurance, this must be given as a benefit of membership to all BCA members; there cannot be an ?opt in/out? option as the BCA cannot sell insurance and we have been informed that this means the benefit must be applied to all full members of the BCA regardless of whether it is actually wanted by that individual.
The BCA Insurance manager, Howard Jones, has been working with the BCA?s insurers and identified a group policy that could be provided at an annual cost of ?13000. Howard proposes that this could be funded through BCA surplus, rather than by increasing membership fees.
It is worth bearing in mind that should the situation change in the future and funding of this becomes financially unviable (either due to increased insurance premium, e.g. following claims, or reduced BCA surplus), the decision to continue include this as a membership benefit would be reviewed on a year by year basis.
Please find details below provided by Howard for consideration by all BCA members. Regional Councils and constituent bodies have been asked to canvass opinion and feedback on whether this would be a membership benefit people would want, and whether they would be happy for ?13000 of BCA money to be spent annually providing this membership benefit. It is worth noting that Howard is also the BCA treasurer, so we can be confident that this has been fully costed.
I am happy to collect feedback on behalf of northern clubs; I would appreciate it if you could please discuss this with your members and feed back to me the general feeling amongst your clubs; roughly what proportion of your membership do you think would support this?
If I could get feedback in time for the CNCC Committee meeting on 22nd June, that would be good.
At the moment the BCA is looking for an ?indicative opinion? to give an idea of whether there is appetite for this from the members, so all feedback is appreciated.
From my personal perspective, I think the BCA is absolutely right to be looking at what additional benefits it can provide for members (as well as what additional it can do for British Caving) using the funds it has available, and Howard has done an excellent job at coming up with this as an option. The question is whether this is something that enough members would actually want.
Please discuss in your clubs and feed back to me your thoughts (secretary[at]cncc.org.uk), which I will pass onto the BCA as the indicative feeling of northern cavers. If anyone has any questions you can contact Howard directly (contact details on BCA website).
Kind regards
Matt Ewles
Secretary, Council of Northern Caving Clubs
The following notes are from Howard Jones, BCA Insurance Manager:
Personal accident (Death and disability) insurance is one of those polices which is very expensive to take out as an individual (especially as a caver) but much cheaper as a group. I asked Howdens to look at a policy for BCA members to go on top of the liability policy already in place as a member benefit. They have advised there is a policy available at a cost of ?2.50 for a caver and ?0.34 for a non-caver which in the event of death or disability due to a caving event would pay out ?50k. Given our current membership the cost would be some ?13,000, less than our surplus in each of the last 2 years. A caving event is defined as the walk to and from the cave (or mine) and the trip underground. Hence the drive to the cave would not be covered.
As well as Death, the following expenses would be covered:
? Accident Medical Expenses: ?2,500
? Coma Benefit: ?50 per full 24 hours up to a maximum of 104 weeks
? Convalescence: ?200 or ?100 for Insured Persons above the age of 70
? Counselling: ?250 up to a maximum of ?5,000 per Insured Person
? Funeral Expenses: ?10,000
? Hospitalisation: ?50 per full 24 hours up to a maximum of 52 weeks.
? Paralysis: Up to ?50,000
If our members don?t have such cover that would respond in the event of a caving incident, this is a significant and cheap member benefit.
Please note this is a proposed member benefit and as such it all or nothing, there is no opt out. The cost of ?13K per annum can be funded in various ways: out of the current surplus (?20k in the last few years), reducing reserves, or increasing subscriptions by the amount of the policy (?2.50 per person).
Proposal: To take out this policy as a member benefit and fund from current surplus.
