Obscure or Obsolete Caving Terms

[Andy Farrant]

As far as I understand it, a ruckle is a  term borrowed from the peat industry, a 'ruckle' being a pile of peat turves (peat 'bricks') stacked up for drying. These 'ruckles' could be a couple of metres tall. So, there is a similarity between a stack of peat turves and a pile of boulders.  Willie Stanton used the term in many of his papers and articles. See https://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/woman-completes-a-ruckle-of-peat-in-somerset-news-photo/3267045

 

[Pie Muncher]

What happens when you find a way through a choke? Does it become a ruckle?

We call it a break through 

 

[JasonC]

What happens when you find a way through a choke? Does it become a ruckle?

We call it a break through 

A chuckle?

 

[Subpopulus Hibernia]

Another term for boulder choke that I've seen is 'Boulder Jam'

I think I read it in J.C. Coleman's Caves of Ireland (1965).

 

[aricooperdavis]

Americans say a room even though it?s the same language (ish).  A pit not a pitch.

I'm not sure an American pit is equivalent to a British pitch, I think it might be closer to a British pot?

 

[mikem]

Do they bother breaking them into pitches?

 

[Subpopulus Hibernia]

Possibly avenir "to come up to", presumably same source as avenue.

Possibly, but it would be odd that the French 'aven' and the English 'aven' would have completely different etymologies to describe almost the same thing.

 

[mikem]

It will have the same root, but isn't necessarily from Avon / afon. May just be that we already had a word for an open vertical shaft, so used it for closed ones.

 

[shotlighter]

Creep hole was one used in the 1950s this comes from a  Sheffield star newspaper article concerning the discovery of a cave during the construction of the taddington bypass, sadly the cave is lost.

I've also come across "creep hole" in some of Nellie Kirkhams write ups. IIRC she  used the term to describe some small passages in the very early bits of Ecton. 

 

[RobinGriffiths]

Sounds a bit Enid Blyton does 'creep hole'. Mind, she used to have a cave or mine in most books.

 

[Duck ditch]

Creep comes before a slump.  Especially on digs I?ve been involved in
Dripstone instead of Flowstone or is it a curtain or a drape.

 

[nearlywhite]

I'm not sure an American pit is equivalent to a British pitch, I think it might be closer to a British pot?

Pits don't have a defined shape and can be open or closed. Also, Avens are Domes - even if they aren't very dome like.

Do they bother breaking them into pitches?

They call them 'multi-drops' and they are considered very technical.

 

[Andy Sparrow]

But what were the words in the original French, as someone else did the translations?

'gut' is possibly a translation for 'meandre', a tall rift

There's a passage in the Dent de Crolles described as 'gut'.  All very low-roofed.  Intestine like rather than tall rift I think.

 

[Fulk]

In Cadoux?s book One Thousand Metres Down the term gallery is used quite a lot, apparently just to refer to a passage; I think that this book was translated and published for a non-specialist readership. e.g.

?Going along a low gallery barely five feet high for some 15 metres . . .? (Interesting mix of units.)

?Several galleries offered exits from the hall. They chose the largest . . . a diaclase . . .?

You don?t often come across diaclase these days.

And what about:

?Wedged tightly in this flattening-mill or rather drawplate . . . . Fancy his having penetrated into this awful cat-run without knowing whether he could get back!?

 

[Fulk]

Quote: 'Dripstone instead of Flowstone'

I was under the impression that 'dripstone' forms by water dripping from the roof, while 'flowstone' is deposited by water flowing over a surface ? so two different things.

 

[Kenilworth]

I'm not sure an American pit is equivalent to a British pitch, I think it might be closer to a British pot?

Pits don't have a defined shape and can be open or closed. Also, Avens are Domes - even if they aren't very dome like.

Do they bother breaking them into pitches?

They call them 'multi-drops' and they are considered very technical.

Generally any vertical component that requires climbing is called a pit. Multi-drop is a term commonly used for a cave that involves multiple pits, not necessarily a single pit broken up into pitches. Nearlywhite is correct in saying that a pit with rebelays is considered technical, since they are relatively uncommon (a result of their being unnecessary).

 

[Subpopulus Hibernia]

?Several galleries offered exits from the hall. They chose the largest . . . a diaclase . . .?

You don?t often come across diaclase these days.

The only place I've seen it is in that book - I think it's just the word that the translator settled on and it never really stuck in general caving parlance.

I think it means what we would refer to now as a rift?

 

[langcliffe]

?Several galleries offered exits from the hall. They chose the largest . . . a diaclase . . .?

You don?t often come across diaclase these days.

The only place I've seen it is in that book - I think it's just the word that the translator settled on and it never really stuck in general caving parlance.

I think it means what we would refer to now as a rift?

Absolutely. It's commonly used in French to describe rift / joint passages, and the translator seems not to have translated it.