Observations on the CNCC AGM

[Bob Mehew]

Deceleration of Interest- I am a member of the GSG and yes the club did attend the meeting with no less a voting representative than Goon plus myself.

There is a limit to the northern boundary, being the top of Britain which in simpler terms is the north coast of Scotland.  (I wonder if Orkney or the Shetlands are caught?)  The meeting did briefly touch on the topic of the Scottish independent referendum when one 'southerly' lad referred to CNCC covering northern England.  Sadly I doubt if the Scottish referendum will hinge on the status of GSG with respect to CNCC.  But on a more serious note, I gather there are some concerns on the impact if Scotland should go independent. I understand questions are being drawn up to be asked (insurance cover is one such question).  There is at least one other Scottish caving club on the BCA list and my memory recalls several more in existence.

 

[graham]

This is getting way off topic, but hey.

If Scotland does choose to go, although some adimin will doubtless need doing, it probably won't affect the BCA insurance, given that SUI is included in the scheme & the Republic of Ireland hasn't been part of the UK for a few years now. However, taking SUi as an example, it is also part of the (French) FFS scheme & although the latter is more expensive it does have considerably better cover, including for cocktail parties (this is not a joke, it does, trust me).

 

[blackholesun]

An letter/email must be sent by someone. I can probably guess, but was it revealed who at the St Helens Caving Club sent the complaint? Was the person chosen by this club to represent their view revealed or was it simply described as coming from a club as if every member held the pen at once or they all pressed the keys together?

 

[graham]

St Helens seems to be quite a long way south of the prescribed geographical limits! 

 

[blackholesun]

Amusing as that would be Graham, the one place on the internet where anything can be found about the St Helens Caving Club is in a newspaper called the St Helens Star, which is based in St Helens, Merseyside, WA10 1RT. This makes it just above the line.

(The nonsensical line that virtually no one else in the country would use to describe the cut off point for the north, that is)

 

[Simon Wilson]

An letter/email must be sent by someone. I can probably guess, but was it revealed who at the St Helens Caving Club sent the complaint? Was the person chosen by this club to represent their view revealed or was it simply described as coming from a club as if every member held the pen at once or they all pressed the keys together?

David Murray of St. Helens Caving Club. I have been told that the email will be in the minutes.

 

[robjones]

speaking as one who has lived on the north coast of Britain, Glasgow always seemed a hell of a distance south to me.  :

On a single drive I saw a sign saying "Watford and the North" and (some hours later) another saying "Stirling and the South".  8)

 

[Bob Mehew]

On a single drive I saw a sign saying "Watford and the North" and (some hours later) another saying "Stirling and the South".  8)

I always liked the sign at Latheronwheel which said "The North " only 33 miles south of John O' Groats.  It is all perspective. 

 

[bograt]

Can anyone who drives away from "The Smog" on the M1/M6 say when the the signs to "The North" peter out??

 

[TheBitterEnd]

In this context who really cares? As others have said it's where you cave not where you live.

But just to add more grist to the mill surely the "North of England" is the part of the county north of the Midlands. And before we get into "a where is the Midlands" debate, it is defined as the set of counties on the map below and roughly equates to the old kingdom of Mercia.

 

[SpeleoTrog]

[quote author=graham] according to Wikipedia: "The United Kingdom lies between latitudes 49? to 61? N"
[/quote]

That would put the North/South divide on a line running roughly between Carlisle and Newcastle.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

 

[Ian Adams]

Looking at the map posted by thebitterend, would the Welsh caving clubs be eligible to join on a "full" membership basis ?

(Personally, I has always considered we would be excluded for being in Wales)

Ian

 

[Andyj23UK]

IAN:  that map highlights the midlands " the north "is above the red counties < aledgedly > - go back to your sheep

 

[scurve]

Isn't the North where people say "Brush" so it rhymes with "Bush",
and "Grass" so it sounds nothing like "Arse."

 

[Pitlamp]

For me the north starts when you get to the Pennines and adjacent areas (to paraphrase a well known geological publication). The Peak District has much more in common with the Dales than it does with Londonshire. Whenever I'm escaping back northwards I always reckon I'm safely home once I get the first glimpse of the Pennine hills.

 

[graham]

(Personally, I has always considered we would be excluded for being in Wales)

A valid consideration.

Grabs tin hat, runs for cover ...

 

[Alex]

Until/unless Scotland get their independence, the north is actually the middle of the country.

 

[cavermark]

The other issue about clubs like SUSS becoming full members of CNCC (in addition to the North/south divide) was that they can only be affiliated to one regional council (SUSS are in DCA).

My view is that, in future, clubs should be able to join and have a say on any regional council that they have a caving interest in (and this can be several). Having a CHECC representative on regional councils may make this process easier in practice (not sure whether CHECC rep should have a weighted vote, or the ability to proxy vote for individual clubs).

I realise this may complicate how BCA funding is distributed, but I hope the new CNCC committee will consider this.

 

[damian]

The other issue about clubs like SUSS becoming full members of CNCC (in addition to the North/south divide) was that they can only be affiliated to one regional council (SUSS are in DCA). [...]I realise this may complicate how BCA funding is distributed, but I hope the new CNCC committee will consider this.

Please note this is not the case. Each Region is autonomous and has its own membership rules. BCA funding does not in any way relate to membership either.

 

[Cavematt]

Hi Cavermark

Thanks for your comments! I couldn't agree more. There are probably many clubs south of the current nominal borderline that cave extensively in Yorkshire/The North and I do not believe that excluding them from participating with the CNCC is correct.

I like the concept of having a CHECC representative on the CNCC (perhaps as a co-opted member or even an additional committee position), as this could provide a representative to speak for university clubs who could potentially provide greater continuity, although I would still rather the universiy clubs took more of a direct involvement wherever possible. This is definitely something to discuss, obviously with the rest of the CNCC committee, and particularly with university clubs themselves to see if this is something they would want.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

Matt