Smoking in Caves

[cfmwh]

Might I suggest a natural alternative to smoking for all those who can't just quit the habit. No placebos, patches or gum......I recommend farting, for the following reasons:

1.) You can fart in very wet caves.
2.) Farts don't cause cancer.
3.) You can never run out of farts.
4.) There is no tax on farts.
5.) Farts don't have to be lit to be enjoyed.
6.) Friends will always share their farts with you.
7.) In a drought, careless farting won't start a bush fire.
8.) You can fart in bed without fear of burning the house down.
9.) You can fart in places where smoking is banned.
10.) Nobody will ever try to blagg a fart off you in the pub.

 

[Pony]

E Cigs are fine underground. Pop em in a strong zip bag. Got to take that precaution, what with all that radon underground.
Back in the day snuff was choice, a good line from elbow to fingertip d keep you going for a couple of hours. 

 

[pwhole]

Yeah, snuff rocks, especially if you actually want a proper hit, which you won't get from fags anyway really. And if you have a large prussik to do, a pinch of mentholated will do the trick!

Support your local snuff mill - Wilson's of Sheffield still grind at their Sharrow mill - since 1737: http://www.sharrowmills.com/

 

[Pony]

Cheers for the suff info, gonna stock up for deffo! Ooohh menthol.
If ever you cave in Nidderdale have a pint at the Lofthouse Crown Hotel and sample a selection of delectable snuff left out on the bar.

 

[bograt]

There are a few records (please don't ask me to quote) of "the way on" being found by smokers detecting draughts, it used to have its uses!, I suppose e fags would work just as well (some of them produce "smoke" don't they?).

 

[Pony]

Aye Bograt, I ve been pushed into boulder chokes with a well stoked B&H to see where to dig next. Good for shake hole draughts, rollies don't give off enough smoke. E Cigs only give off water vapour when you draw, it disapates too quickly.
One thing that always amuses me is how some non smokers get pretty friendly whilst you ve got a fag on getting changed and the midges are chewing on yer nuts. LOL

 

[bograt]

I'd forgotten about the changing / camping bit, many times I was asked "are you going to light up or what?". Of course, in them days nobody died if they breathed your smoke, its different now.

 

[Pony]

Too right fella! ULSA used B&H draught detectors to great effect. Imagine students being able to afford 20 Bennny Hedgehogs nowadays.
I have a copy of British Caving and in the chapter on rescue one of items on the kit list is cigarettes.
Don't know if they were for the patient or the team

 

[droid]

I smoke. I used to smoke down caves. Things move on, and just like drink/driving isn't socially acceptable any more, neither is smoking down caves, so I don't.

Although I suspect that NewStuff does what I do....make sure the ciggies are within easy access when I emerge...

 

[PaulW]

surely smoking in a cave is the same as smoking in an enclosed pubilc space.

Oh no, you  can't do that anymore 

 

[jonnyrocketboots]

I think it depends on your choice of smoke chaps!    I've witnessed some passive smoking in an enclosed environment with comical results! 

Time and a place I suppose!?!

JRB

 

[Blakethwaite]

Smoking in caves is rubbish. No matter how hard you try they invariably get soggy & fall to bits & try buying a replacement pack of tabs after six on a Sunday night on the drive back down Wensleydale & you'll soon learn what desperation means...

Smoking in mines is terrible too, as soon as you get below 16% O2 a clipper simply won't work. 

 

[Pony]

Smoking in caves is rubbish. No matter how hard you try they invariably get soggy & fall to bits & try buying a replacement pack of tabs after six on a Sunday night on the drive back down Wensleydale & you'll soon learn what desperation means...

It's all a case of technique. I've kept a fag going through Hydrophobia and had to have a rollie in the Great Airbell seeing as everyone was titting about, they soon got a shift on. When I emerged on the other side and took my mask off two smoke rings rose up from my eyes. The lads in the Wessex were convinced I had me bottles filled wth GV
Remember kids, it's not big and it's not clever!

 

[Blakethwaite]

Remember kids, it's not big and it's not clever!

Just cool. 8)

 

[NewStuff]

I do smoke, but not even in my own house. I do smoke underground as well. I try to be considerate with it (at the back or away from the main group), and if someone asks, I'll try to oblige within reason (sometimes, You can't move back any more, or that shaft is going to swallow you up), but I get my back right up if someone has the temerity to *tell* me to not smoke.  At that point, I'll chain them, just for shits and giggles. The working are usually big enough for them to f*** off elsewhere, just as easily as I can do so. This has only happened once. Most people know I'm a right nasty f***** if I can't get my fix (the other vice being copious amount of caffeine, but energy drink is not, as of yet, socially demonised), and accept it as the lesser of two evils. It may not be to everyone's tastes or sensibilities, but that's life.

EDIT:-

And now I want a fag... and it's cold and snowy outside... 

 

[Hammy]

Well thank you all for your replies.

I asked the question as I have noticed that the BCA Cave Conservation Code makes no reference to smoking, and that the Minimum Impact Caving Code is under review.

I wonder about the disturbance to bats and possibly other delicate fauna.

The replies had only one reference to the matter of conservation from Jessop Smythe and he/she states that smoking has nothing to do with conservation. This makes me assume that the rather limited sample of cavers on this forum do not see this as a problem to the cave environment, only to other cavers.

Personally I would like to see the subject of smoking in caves clearly defined as detrimental to the cave environment and considered to be as heinous a crime as direct wilful damage to speleothems, sediments etc. and contravention of access procedures, with the ultimate sanction of offending clubs and individuals being excommunicated from the BCA.

Perhaps the powers that be might consider this when reviewing the above mentioned documents.

 

[Blakethwaite]

Out of genuine interest, where do you believe the damage is being caused? Is there any evidence you can share?
Do you have any figures re the number of cavers who smoke underground?

 

[SpeleoTrog]

The replies had only one reference to the matter of conservation from Jessop Smythe and he/she states that smoking has nothing to do with conservation. This makes me assume that the rather limited sample of cavers on this forum do not see this as a problem to the cave environment, only to other cavers.

Sorry -  I didn't mean to imply that smoking in a cave has no impact on conservation, merely that it's not my primary objection.
I'm sure smoke could have a detrimental effect but probably not in the concentrations we're likely to see in a cave (unless they were opened up by CROW, in which case, untold millions of people could come in and smoke til they drop!)

 

[kieronyoung]

Technically if you are surveying a cave or doing any "work" it would be illegal to smoke in a cave any way as it would be classed as a work place. also if someone is taking you on a tour of the cave as someone who has been down the cave before and know the way, even if volunteering it would be classed as a work space. same as if the organised went down with you it would be his work space as he organised it. (Unless my understanding of the law is wrong)

 

[pwhole]

I can think of far more heinous crimes than smoking in caves, especially ones with a good through-draught. The mild remaining depositions of particulates from the odd fag are unlikely to make much difference to any cave ecology, especially if the butts are removed. It's hardly a common occurrence thse days. And who would police such crimes?

What about urinating? Many cavers have to do that underground, and at sites that may be of particular conservation interest, or have important hydrology. Or poor air circulation. But when you gotta go...