"The Economic Miracle of China" Is the pollution worth it?

[whitelackington]

Such a massive volume of polution is being emptied into rivers in China, that wetlands, coastal regions and the sea off china are being decimated, fish stocks have plumeted with the lower oxygen levels.
This madness is not sustainable.
The World buying their cheap goods is what is fueling this rapid expansion,
at it seems, any cost.
The cost, is our environment.

 

[cap n chris]

I don't think it's got much to do with the asking price of the goods; even if they put their prices up the side-effects of manufacturing processes wouldn't disappear.

I think you'll find that one of the chief reasons why manufacturing (and, as a result, cheap goods) is being done anywhere other than in western societies is because we have priced ourselves out of the market by having so many rules and regulations over what can and cannot be done - onesuch being the cost of compliance with environmental legislation! - oh, the irony!

Sorry, Whitelackington, but whinging about stuff ain't gonna make tuppence worth of difference. I refer to my previous list of things to do if you want to save the world, item no. 1 - "Stop buying stuff". Mind you, for this plan to work and save the planet, everyone must do similarly - but the disastrous consequences of mass famine, rioting etc. probably aren't much more acceptable than the hardship of not being a consumer in a materialist/capitalist society.

I think you should ask for the world to be stopped, so you can get off.

Oh, and BTW, "sustainability" is a myth, a sick joke and is designed to fool the gullible - for as long as the world population increases by a billion people every 13 years (i.e. unsustainably) then the very concept of sustainability is self-evidently an obvious impossibility.

 

[whitelackington]

"I think you should ask for the world to be stopped, so you can get off.

Oh, and BTW, "sustainability" is a myth, a sick joke and is designed to fool the gullible - for as long as the world population increases by a billion people every 13 years (i.e. unsustainably) then the very concept of sustainability is self-evidently an obvious impossibility. " Captain Chris

I largely agree, I would have said ,  would have liked to of got off about 1980
but then I only bought my 36 volt Lithium Hilti Drill (for caving)
last year, so I couldn't really get off till then, which, I suppose, partly proves your point, Captain, I am almost as guilty as the Chinese
but I am not over procreating or causing too much polution, I also do not change my stuff regularly, I drive an 18 year old car, I still have crap from thirty years ago, still use my origonal divers bag I bought to put my caving gear in.
What is the answer then
to all this warming polution?

 

[cap n chris]

There isn't one. Simply carry on enjoying your time here on planet earth and let everyone else worry themselves sick about an insoluble fact - largely worried over by the very people ensuring the problem escalates..... parents!

 

[AndyF]

I've got a vegatable patch and a shotgun . I don't care. 

The world is stuffed, enjoy it while you can. Have a nice day y'all....

 

[whitelackington]

China's environmental watchdog has handed the maximum possible fine to a PetroChina subsidiary for a toxic river spill which cut off water to millions.
Jilin Petrochemical was ordered to pay 1m yuan ($125,000, £64,000) for its pollution of the Songhua River in 2005, state-run Xinhua news agency reported.

A blast at its chemical plant in Jilin province discharged about 100 tonnes of the carcinogen benzene into the river.

The city of Harbin lost water supplies for five days, and Russia was also hit.

China's State Environmental Protection Agency found the company guilty of three counts of breaking environmental law.

Last year China said it had given "administrative demerits" to a provincial official and several PetroChina executives.


More than 3 million Harbin residents were left without fresh water

The benzene caused an 80km (50-mile) slick and dramatically elevated benzene levels in the river.

The polluted water flowed into Harbin, leaving 3.8 million residents with no access to clean water, and then onwards to the Russian city of Khabarovsk. 

 

[whitelackington]

Well, at least The Chinese realize the polution is wrong :-\

 

[paul]

Well, at least The Chinese realize the polution is wrong :-\

Pity the Americans don't ...

 

[AndyF]

Well, at least The Chinese realize the polution is wrong :-\

Ha! I don't think £64,000 fine for destroying the water supply to 3,000,000 people is exactly tough measures!

 

[whitelackington]

I wonder what a "Demerit "is
do you think it is the same as hanging?

 

[whitelackington]

Such a massive volume of polution is being emptied into rivers in China, that wetlands, coastal regions and the sea off china are being decimated, fish stocks have plumeted with the lower oxygen levels.
This madness is not sustainable.
The World buying their cheap goods is what is fueling this rapid expansion,
at it seems, any cost.
The cost, is our environment.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6582571.stm

 

[whitelackington]

It wil be impossible for us to economically compete with China
they are using child and slave labour
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6759399.stm

 

[cap n chris]

Correct. During the 19th Century Great Britain was the superpower; during the 20th Century it was the USA; during the 21st it will be (if it isn't already) either China or India. Our country's economy seems to be based on credit, spiralling (virtual) property "values" and people doing odd jobs for one another.

 

[bubba]

It wil be impossible for us to economically compete with China
they are using child and slave labour
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6759399.stm

Rather like the UK used to, when we were (as CC says) a superpower

In reply to the OP, I can't see the point of pontificating about whether it's worth it or not - it's happening and is inevitable that it gets worse - who's going to stop it?

 

[whitelackington]

It Will be impossible for us to economically compete with China
they are using child and slave labour
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6759399.stm

Rather like the UK used to, when we were (as CC says) a superpower

In reply to the OP, I can't see the point of pontificating about whether it's worth it or not - it's happening and is inevitable that it gets worse - who's going to stop it?

You are absolutely correct Bubba,
we did indeed use very young child labour in this country,
much of it amounting to slave labour.

We are presently looking at old man workings, above Upper Flood Swallet,
Charterhouse-on-Mendip,
we have been asking each other as many can not  squeeze along,
"Were these done by midgets or children"

I looked up on the internet and it was not uncommon for six year old children to be used in these  narrow workings,
all this barely 200 years ago in England,
not slaves as such but our own people.

 

[Peter Burgess]

It wil be impossible for us to economically compete with China
they are using child and slave labour
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6759399.stm

Rather like the UK used to, when we were (as CC says) a superpower

In reply to the OP, I can't see the point of pontificating about whether it's worth it or not - it's happening and is inevitable that it gets worse - who's going to stop it?

You are absalutely correct Bubba, we did indeed use very young child labour in this country,
much of it amounting to slave labour.

We are presently looking at old man workings, above Upper Flood Swallet,
Charterhouse-on-Mendip,
we have been asking each other as many we could not squeeze alone, "Were these done by midgets or children"

I looked up on the internet and it was not uncommon for six year old children to be used in these  narrow workings,
all this barely 200 years ago in England,
not slaves as such but our own people.

I expect what happened was that in order for a miner to make a living he had to get members of his family to work with him. The mine owner didn't care less how the miner produced the ore. The children were useful for getting into the places that were too narrow for an adult. I expect the WAGs were also involved too, but not being paid to appear on the front covers of glossy magazines like they are today.

 

[cap n chris]

There are child's hand prints from 1753 in a mud bank in a lead mine (Grebe Swallet) at Charterhouse - guessing from the size I'd say six years old isn't far off.

 

[AndyF]

I'd like todays troublesome teenagers to be forced back to work down the mines when they make a nuisance of themselves. Certianly beats the hell out of a "ASBO"

Some people may view this as fairly extreme.... they are correct, it is. 

 

[Peter Burgess]

There are child's hand prints from 1753 in a mud bank in a lead mine (Grebe Swallet) at Charterhouse - guessing from the size I'd say six years old isn't far off.

This is a very precise date, Chris. How come?

 

[cap n chris]

Nah, far too liberal.