Author Topic: blacknor/sandy hole survey  (Read 7507 times)

Offline 987056

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blacknor/sandy hole survey
« on: December 25, 2010, 05:12:05 pm »
Has any one ever surveyed blacknor/sandy hole?

Offline Cap'n Chris

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #1 on: December 25, 2010, 05:54:54 pm »
Yes. Can't remember who off the top of my head, though.

Offline Les W

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #2 on: December 25, 2010, 06:18:42 pm »
I can't find the book at the moment (Caves of Portland) but at a guess it might have been Mike O'Connor, Nigel Graham or Ed Waters.

I might be wrong though. :-\
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Offline menacer

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #3 on: December 25, 2010, 07:10:08 pm »
Mike Reid/reed/read in the Chelsea.S.S will be able to help with this.
There is a new survey out in the pipe line (within last 3/4 years) i think.
Not sure if published yet.



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Offline Ed W

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #4 on: December 25, 2010, 09:28:42 pm »
The Blacknor Hole / Sandy Hole system has been surveyed to a very high standard.  Separate surveys of Blacknor Hole and Sandy Hole appear in "The Caves of the Isle of Portland" produced by the Wessex.  The surveys being produced by the MSG (Sandy Hole) and Weymouth & Portland Venture Scouts (Blacknor Hole).

The aboe book was published at the time the conection between the two caves was made, so teh connection is not included.  The major extensions south of the choke in Ammonite Passage were found a couple of years later.  Between 1995 and 2000 (ish) the entire system was resurveyed, but to my knowledge Mike Read has never published it.

The Wessex book is very good (and has an exceptionally handsome young chap on the cover), and if it is still available well worth  the £10 they ask for it.
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Online mrodoc

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2010, 12:18:28 am »
You can also find other postings on the topic of exploration in Sandy on the Forum. Some photos of the caves at http://www.darkanddeep.co.uk/caving_dorset.asp

Offline 987056

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2010, 03:10:00 pm »
Thanks, any one got a copy of 'the caves of the isle of portland' avalibal? or know if the new servey.

From the pics it looks worth a visit. is any aditional equipent?

Offline Les W

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2010, 03:30:39 pm »
You may still be able to get a copy from the Wessex, I believe there are still a few left.
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Offline Oceanrower

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2010, 04:39:06 pm »
There are definitely some at the Wessex still - available for the princely sum of ten quid (if I remember correctly) Failing that I've got a copy you can borrow. Never got round to Blacknor yet but it's definitely on my tick list.  :-\ Must do it soon.

Had a play ion Sandy Hole last year - Whoever named it that had one hell of a sense of humour!  :yucky:

Offline Ed W

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2010, 03:41:56 pm »
The first bit of passage just inside the entrance did used to be quite sandy, hence the name. This sand has gradually diappeared over the years.  Its not all bad though, as you no longer have all the sandstick to the stickymud from te rest fo the cave, so no longer emmerge asa human fish finger.
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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2010, 02:29:08 pm »
It is worth noting that quite a tricky little climb is needed to get into the cave nowadays as the cliff base has slumped. Originally it was an easy clamber but now it requires quite an exposed move to get in so worth taking a rope or sling and a decent climber.

Offline 987056

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2011, 01:22:43 pm »
i read some were (on this forum i think) that sandy hole is heading for an active resurgence, does any one know were it sinks?

Offline zaphod79

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2011, 05:19:14 pm »
I used to be a regular visitor to both these caves having grown up on Portland, bit difficult to get to now living in Yorkshire.  My wife and I went to visit Blacknor last year only to discover the stakes removed.   :chair:

I have done the through trip a couple of times, but Im not sure of how easy it is to do a through trip from Sandy to Blacknor. 

With regards to a resurgence, I heard a rumour of Sandy Hole having a sea sump.  but this was only a rumour.

Offline Ed W

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2011, 06:00:25 pm »
The extreme southern end of Sandy Hole is heading roughly along the dry valley from Sweethill towards the small resurgence (Priors Well?) which lies just north of the road leading to Portland Bill.  The rising is hidden in some scrub close to the Mesolithic site with the information boards.  There is no flowing water seen anywhere in Sandy Hole, and the source of the water in the rising is unknown, but as there are no known sinks, it is probably percolation water.

Ed
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Offline tim.rose2

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2011, 07:30:34 pm »
Hi,

The spring is culverwell - a couple of pictures can be seen here: http://www.geoffkirby.co.uk/Portland/680690.  The stream only flows during winter months.  The rest of the year the "resurgence" is a wet muddy puddle surrounded by weeds, flies and midges!

Tim

Offline pete h

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2011, 06:55:46 pm »
PORTLAND. Nigel Graham found the questions about Portland caves, but being unable to register access to the Forum, asked if he could reply via me.
 
1) Sandy Hole ( Ammonite Passage). As Ed Waters said, ask Mike Read (Chelsea Speleo. Soc.). Mike & his mates have not published their survey, perhaps because they've not really abandoned the place!
I doubt very much it has anything to do with Culverwell (spring) as suggested, because Sandy Hole is far too deep, near the base of the Cherty Series of the Portland Limestones, & so far at least, dry. The spring is up on the Purbeck Formation. However, there are deeper-lying karst passage remnants at The Bill... 
 
2) Fossil Cave: Open but it's acquired a substantial steel gate - why, when, by whom all unknown. In December 2010, Kev & Charlotte Hilton & I (all WCC) found the gate, a surprise to us, wide open, with no obvious way to lock it. The approach is as unpleasant as ever but the cave was remarkably clean, though we removed candle-stubs & some litter.
 
3) Blacknor Hole. Still no access but I've contacted a climbing organisation to see what's what on the cliff. After all the problems in 2003, first between householders & cavers/ climbers then between the two householders, followed by change of ownership and a new home built on the site, I thought it better to keep a discreet distance until things had settled.
 
4) Allotment Dig. I was one of its diggers. Blocked? Where? How? News to me, though I've not visited it for a few years. I'll take a look! Seems odd anyone would have blocked it deliberately, but the thought of a collapse is worrying as it's close to the surface.
 
5) Cheyne Weares. One or two ferrets have tried the rift in an old quarry just S of Cheyne House, without success (too tight even for ferrets).
 
6) Elsewhere on Portland.
The Inmosthay caves have all gone, though a fine sediment-choked phreatic tube revealed by the same active quarrying has been recorded.
No known active local caving on Portland at present, unless any youth groups still visit Flagpole Rift.
 
If you need any other information Nigel is happy to reply via his e mail, pm me and i will forward it to you

Pete

Offline tim.rose2

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2011, 08:48:46 pm »
I can answer the question regarding the gate to fossil cave - a few years ago (a guess would be 5) one of the local quarries were blasting close to the cave.  I believe the quarry men put the gate up and at the time it was locked and entry to the cave was banned by the local council (all local outdoor activity groups were informed).  Once the blasting was finished (after a period of a year or two) the lock was removed however the gate remained.

Regarding allotment dig...  I made a trip to flagpole in sept 09 and had planned to exit via allotment dig.  Having not been in the cave for a few years (but knowing it well from the 30 + trips I'd done previously) I was surprised I couldn't find the climb out of guano rift and a load of spoil blocking the rift where I'd expected the hole to be.  Since then someone has told me (can't remember who) they've looking in from the top and the rift down is blocked.  Keep meaning to go back and have a proper look myself.

Went into Windy dig, Sandy (briefly) and Cherty last weekend - nothing different with these!

Tim

Offline 987056

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2011, 07:16:51 pm »
thanks for the info are there any good prospects for portland remaining or just dry crawls? and are there any known caves on the isle of purbeck?

Offline portlandcaver

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #18 on: May 16, 2011, 11:02:05 am »
anyone been in any of the caves in bowers quarry (other than the now infilled st george's rift) ive noticed a few human sized rifts and wondered if anyone has been down them or wants to, best hurry tho before they are infilled like the rest of the caves, also noted a cave in sharbutts quarry not far from persil, looked quite decorated especialy for portland. wondered if anybody visiting portland would like to have them pointed out, dont hesitate to ask as wouldlove to go exploring them.

Offline Ed W

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #19 on: May 16, 2011, 06:16:34 pm »
Various cavities have opened up in the working quarries over the years, and just as quickly been quarried away.  I have been in St George's Rift (which was close to the edge of the working Bower's Quarry and covered in over burden c.1990).  The cave was quite sporting and well decorated in places.  I was also involved in exploring and surveying a large slip rift - Bower's Rift in the working part of the Bower's quarry in 1991 (the survey is on Page 89 of Caves of Portland).  This was an impressive cave, well decorated and with an unusual mechanically formed "bedding plane" at the end.  As with many of the rifts encountered by teh quarries, it was used as a convenient boundary for the quarryiong which removed one wall leaving teh quarry wall covered in stal.

I'm a bit confused when you say in "Sharbutts cloe to Persil".  Persil Rift is in an old disused quarry close to Blacknor Fort, whereas Sharbutt's Quarry lies further south above Sandy Hole.  If it is in a working quarry, it would be useful to record the site (location, survey photos etc) before it is quarries away.  However I am sure I do not need to tell you to be especially careful in caves located in active quarries.  Unfortunately I also suspect that the quarry owners are not quite as free and easy about accessing such sites as they used to be.

Best of luck!
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Offline portlandcaver

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #20 on: June 05, 2011, 11:37:12 pm »
i have my quarrys crossed, along the cliff path to the left of the little "quarry" pesil is in is a much larger quarry with a steep path at the far end, as you walk in there are exposed rock faces removed in the old portland fashion of following natural rifts, in one corner of a quarry face is a rift cave, there seemed to be what looked like a sheet dumped in it so people obviously know its there, its and old quarry not an active one, hope you might be able to identify it now, if not maybe it hasnt been explored before. grid reference: sy 68025 71730 hope this helps.

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Re: blacknor/sandy hole survey
« Reply #21 on: February 17, 2018, 06:05:50 am »
Portland caves have been added to MCRA since this post, but the last mentioned does not appear to have been included -grid ref is just east of this:
http://www.mcra.org.uk/registry/sitedetails.php?id=2649

Mike