Author Topic: Carlswark Dynamite series. (Read 22064 times)

danthecavingman · « **on:** July 11, 2005, 01:18:30 pm »

I'm planning a trip down Carlswark on Wednesday, intending to venture into the dynamite series. Anyone else been there? What's it like and does it deserve Derbyshire Grade V? Tight? Muddy? Pretty?

I also heard a rumour about an obscure entrance that leads straight into the Dynamite series. Called Flower Pot entrance or something? Anyone know where it is and if it's manageable by normal sized people?

Cheers,

Dan.

danthecavingman · « **Reply #1 on:** July 12, 2005, 11:33:20 am »

No one been?

No worries, I will post a description if it's wanted after my visit tomorrow. I was hoping someone knew about the other entrance.

Dan.

bubba · « **Reply #2 on:** July 12, 2005, 11:35:25 am »

Dynamite is a good trip but I've not been in it (apart from getting stuck coming back through the first squeeze last year :oops: ) for years, and I was much slimmer then. I remember it being tight and awkward, but not horrendous by any means. There's some interesting old mine passage but didn't see any formations whatsoever.

SamT · « **Reply #3 on:** July 12, 2005, 12:43:22 pm »

Went quite a way a few years back.

Basically a series of parallel rifts joined by tight crawls/squeezes at floor level.

I got through porth crawl but my mate got well stuck in it so we had to turn round at that point (dont think there was much further to go)

Other entrance?? I think the end is close to surface but I was unaware of another entrance.

Mark'll know. (or try emailing john beck)

Cave_Troll · « **Reply #4 on:** July 12, 2005, 12:54:40 pm »

or Keith

Dave H · « **Reply #5 on:** July 12, 2005, 03:11:58 pm »

There is a third entrance in the grounds of the Old People's Home. My mate Robin and I spent quite a while talking with the new owner a couple of years ago (well he was new then) and he seemed pretty amenable to visits so long as you asked first (in normal clothes - we don't want to frighten the coffin dodgers now!) The entrance was very overgrown and didn't look like it had been touched for years. We never did get back to have a proper look with gear. :cry:

AndyF · « **Reply #6 on:** July 12, 2005, 03:58:42 pm »

Quote from: "danthecavingman"

I also heard a rumour about an obscure entrance that leads straight into the Dynamite series. Called Flower Pot entrance or something? Anyone know where it is and if it's manageable by normal sized people?

Hi Dan,

Yes, Flower Pot does exist, we dug it open about twelve years ago, and yes, it does go directly into Dynamite Series, emerging in Falls Chamber. To find it, go up the hill from the the Junction on the main road,past the sub-station, and on the left further up is a parking place below a small cliff. Flower pot is on the opposite side of the road (right going uphill), about 15 feet from the road, 10 feet above road level, though you'll have to scabble around to find it under leaves I guess.

It has 4 blue barrels as the entrance. These have been squashed over time, but the way may still be open.

The route is fairly obvious, with several flat out but not too horrific squeezes into Big Dig, including a sit down dog-leg thing...

The hard part of Dynamite Series (!) (and the reason for the entrance) is Porth Crawl, which is frighteningly tight. I bottled it, and have never passed it, but beyond (apparently) is pristine passage and some potential digs. Very few people have been there.

We intended to tackle the digs, but sorta lost interest......

There was another entrance to Carlswark called "Deep Shaft", up on the hill, but that was blocked when Big Dig was passed in the 70's

AndyF

AndyF · « **Reply #7 on:** July 12, 2005, 04:01:56 pm »

Quote from: "Dave H"

There is a third entrance in the grounds of the Old People's Home.

I think you mean Eyam Dale House Cave. It doesn't connect to Carlswark, but is probably part of the same system. It's quite a good trip, with an impressive rift at the end.

A dig at the end MAY connect to Carlswark Dynamite series if it were pushed....

Dave H · « **Reply #8 on:** July 12, 2005, 04:10:26 pm »

:worthy: Thanks AndyF - maybe the caver who was encouraging us so much to go and have a look at it, had a hidden agenda and expected us to dig it for him!

AndyF · « **Reply #9 on:** July 12, 2005, 04:25:12 pm »

Hi Dave,

Eyam Dale House Cave is a very worthwhile trip, probably the best in Stoney, but IFTM that the entrance (a mine shaft) had a broken sewer pipe leaking into it, affecting the shaft itself. :shock: Eek!

The dig was a silted crawl that had been dug for a hundred feet or so, and could be dug further by a keen team with some drag trays, making a fairly hard through trip if the connection could be gained...

http://www.eldon.org.uk/reports.html#eyamdale

mudmonkey · « **Reply #10 on:** July 12, 2005, 05:38:57 pm »

Never noticed any sewage - done a couple of trips in Eyam Dale House over the last couple of years.

danthecavingman · « **Reply #11 on:** July 12, 2005, 08:52:21 pm »

Just been on the phone to John Beck,

He reckons that the bottom of the Flower Pot entrance ran in a while ago and that it is no longer accessible

. Apparently the barrels are quite tight and if it's blocked at the bottom then getting back out could be a nightmare! :twisted: Dug out by the Keyhole Caving Club - was that you then Andy?

John also kept repeating the phrase "very tight" in regard to the Dynamite Series and particularly Porth Crawl. He did add that Mark Noble got through by being very determined while other smaller cavers refused it. I guess it's time to see how determined I am..... :cry:

From what John said there are some good leads beyond Porth Crawl, not just a possible connection with EDHC but also a big natural passage choked in both directions - sounds like potential to me. Not being the thinnest of cavers I don't imagine I'll get to the end but it sounds intriguing. I can only imagine that it's hard work getting to these leads otherwise they would have been pushed before..... :roll:

Mark · « **Reply #12 on:** July 13, 2005, 06:37:12 am »

Quote from: "danthecavingman"

He did add that Mark Noble got through by being very determined while other smaller cavers refused it.

For determined read thin, I doubt if I would get any where near it now,

We dug through Porth crawl in 1972 there are quite a few leads left in there.

The old man has stacked rock everywhere filling up some quite large phreatic passages

"Pristine and pretty" ?

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

bubba · « **Reply #13 on:** July 13, 2005, 09:07:55 am »

The furthest I got into it was into a room where a very small circular tube-like passage in the floor led off for what appeared to be some way. It looked nasty tight. There were lots of digging buckets and stuff lying about.

This would have been sometime in the late 80's - was I looking at Porth Crawl?

AndyF · « **Reply #14 on:** July 13, 2005, 09:36:30 am »

Quote from: "mudmonkey"

Never noticed any sewage - done a couple of trips in Eyam Dale House over the last couple of years.

it may be fixed now, this was about 12 years ago...

AndyF · « **Reply #15 on:** July 13, 2005, 09:46:36 am »

Quote from: "bubba"

The furthest I got into it was into a room where a very small circular passage in the floor led off for what appeared to be some way. There were lots of digging buckets and stuff lying about.

This would have been sometime in the late 80's - was I looking at Porth Crawl?

No I don't think so. There was a duck, which the buckets were used to bail, before the junction where the route to Falls Chamber splits off. After Flower Pot was opened, the increased draught seemed to leave the duck dry most of the time.

The barrels in Flower Pot did get a bit squashed, but if you throw a ladder or knotted rope down and take a look, I don't think you'd have a nightmare climbing back out. At the bottom, you slide down a slope into a short length of solid mine level, then duck back under to reach Falls Chamber.

The idea was to improve speed to get to Porth Crawl, then widen it to allow access to the digs up there. We went onto other digs shortly afterwards, so never persued that plan.

bubba · « **Reply #16 on:** July 13, 2005, 09:53:58 am »

Yeah, this crawl was totally dry - I turned back at that point because it looked very tight, there were only two of us, and the lass I was with wasn't very experienced. I also thought we'd reached the end point digs

Obviously it gets worse from then on in....

Don't think I'd even get that far these days. Best thing I remember from the trip is the old mine passage.

AndyF · « **Reply #17 on:** July 13, 2005, 09:56:14 am »

Quote from: "danthecavingman"

Just been on the phone to John Beck,

Dug out by the Keyhole Caving Club - was that you then Andy?

Yep. It was us m'lud.

Quote

From what John said there are some good leads beyond Porth Crawl, not just a possible connection with EDHC but also a big natural passage choked in both directions - sounds like potential to me.

A link with EDHC would be cool, its about time Carlswark got some more attention... If I was planning to try, I'd probably dig from the EDHC end. IIRC, the dig was a comfortable phreatic tube, silted at the end with airspace over the top. It would need a group with drag trays, and steady progress could be made. You might make a meter or two per dig.

If you were serious about digging beyond Porth Crawl, I may even be prevailed upon to persuade it to be a bit bigger. We have the technology to do that....

Somewhere I read a description of Picnic passage by Pete Mellors, who described a cross rift at the end which could be dug.

danthecavingman · « **Reply #18 on:** July 13, 2005, 11:38:38 am »

Well I'm going to the Dynamite series tonight we'll see how that goes. I reckon next Wednesday will be a trip down EDHC to have a look at this dig. I'm keen for a project at the minute and I agree that Carlswark deserves some more attention. If EDHC can be connected then it sounds more viable than persuading Porth Crawl. John said that a smoke test had proved the link between Picnic Passage and EDHC. Anyone any idea how far apart the two are? I think I need to get a survey of EDHC in relation to Carlswark.

Cheers for the info guys,

Dan.

AndyF · « **Reply #19 on:** July 13, 2005, 12:23:31 pm »

Quote from: "danthecavingman"

I think I need to get a survey of EDHC in relation to Carlswark.

Hi, I have a copy somewhere of a map of all the Stoney caves on one sheet. I can't remember if it has EDHC on it. I'll see if I can find it.

It was prepared by John Beck, he must have the original.

If you are interested in a project in Stoney that is less gruesome to get to, then I can point you at a nice one in Rubble Rift. A nice size silt filled tube five minutes from the surface, with fill disposal sapce ten feet away. It was our dig before Waterways Swallet took over our lives, and I'll be digging in there for the rest of my life I think (!) so you could take that one over if you want.

It has the potential to link to Hangover hole about 30m away, or other stuff in the area. It really needs someone to do it...

There is also a nice dig to do in Watergrove Sough, digging through the run in shaft near the end. It may continue on the other side, which would go into a big block of Limestone..... Would need shoring taking there, and only do-able in the Summer

SamT · « **Reply #20 on:** July 13, 2005, 12:23:41 pm »

nice one - go for it.

However let me know before anyone widens porth crawl - I'd like a crack at it before just for posterity. Thinking about it - the point I reached sounds like it wasnt porth crawl but the old duck that bubs mentioned.

may have to go down some time and have another look.

danthecavingman · « **Reply #21 on:** July 13, 2005, 12:32:26 pm »

Andy, you have my attention with Rubble Rift, as I am out that way tonight then maybe I will have a look if you can spill the beans.....

AndyF · « **Reply #22 on:** July 13, 2005, 01:20:35 pm »

Here is a link to surveys:-

http://www.keyhole.org.uk/digs_rubble.asp

http://www.keyhole.org.uk/digs_hangover.asp

The dig in Rubble is marked as the "Silted Tube Dig". It's a comfortable tube size, sit on yer bum and hack away. needs an extra person to drag trays out and dump the spoil down the pot (which draughted, but was impossible to dig due to liquid goo)

If you haven't been in Hangover Hole, take a look around that too...

danthecavingman · « **Reply #23 on:** July 13, 2005, 01:44:32 pm »

Sounds to me like there's potential on t'other side of the Dale....

I doubt if anyone else is familiar with this but back in the mid nineties TSG were digging a site under the command of PB. If you come up Stoney Dale and turn sharp left after the bend you end up on a small road leading to Cavendish Mill. About 300 yds or so up the road on the right was a spot where a huge beech tree had come down. The tree was covering an old mine shaft that dropped into choked natural passage below but didn't go anywhere. We were digging there before Dowel Dale Side Pot took over. The last I remember of it was trying to shift the stump to allow better access to the mine shaft. The site is roughly located at OS Ref SK 209756. Still worth another look if I remember correctly.

Dan.

Dave H · « **Reply #24 on:** July 13, 2005, 01:53:17 pm »

Andy,

I've just read the trip report for Eyam Dale House Cave and it's not very reminicent of what we saw. This shaft was 20' across, with ivy growing down the walls, but I couldn't see any grill or gate. I didn't want to go too near to the edge though, so I don't know how deep it was. It was situated above the shaft entrance of Carlswalk (opposite the sub-station) near the wall seperating the slope from the grassy, level fields. And it was definately owned by the old-people's home.