Author Topic: Smoking Weed Underground  (Read 3284 times)

Offline pwhole

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #50 on: May 18, 2021, 11:41:23 pm »
And this just in - ohohoh. I look forward to comments tomorrow evening, but it's past my bedtime :)

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/18/any-amount-of-alcohol-consumption-harmful-to-the-brain-finds-study

Higher volume of alcohol consumption per week was associated with lower grey matter density – the researchers found, with alcohol explaining up to a 0.8% change in grey matter volume, even after accounting for individual biological and behavioural characteristics. This might seem like a small figure, but it is a larger contribution than any other modifiable risk factors. For example, it is four times the contribution of smoking or BMI, said Topiwala.

Offline Paul Marvin

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #51 on: May 19, 2021, 08:09:53 am »
It's also looking possible that THC may reduce the likelihood of developing lung cancer, and reduce the growth of existing tumours, but it is early days yet, and studies are hard to get started for the simple reason the stuff is still illegal in many countries. But smoking in a radon atmosphere isn't a good idea, whatever it is. Just go to Matlock Bath caves and mines if you must do it as there's no radon there :)

I would have thought the Matlock areas was high in Radon ? we only live 5 mins away and had to do all sorts when we bought our house for the so so high Radon in the area   :-\
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Online mikem

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #52 on: May 19, 2021, 08:59:27 am »
Granite generally contains more radon than limestone (so avoid Edinburgh & Cornwall...)

Online AR

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #53 on: May 19, 2021, 09:03:29 am »
I suspect most of the cave radon monitoring in recent years has focused on the Castleton area, close to the shale margin, but that doesn't mean there aren't issues elsewhere. I recall being told by one of the guides at Middleton Top Engine House that they are limited to the number of hours they can do each year due to radon build-up in the buildings, and I can't help but wonder whether Omya did monitoring in the stone mine when it was working - they probably did have to, though their ventilation systems would likely have stopped build-up. I think you might get a nasty surprise if you were to do some radon monitoring off the main routes of the popular Matlock mines...
Dirty old mines need love too....

Offline RobinGriffiths

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #54 on: May 19, 2021, 10:12:20 am »
Now you definitely woudn't want to smoke in Kingswood Mine, Devon - or probably even enter it.

Online mikem

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #55 on: May 19, 2021, 10:18:45 am »
Counts inside the mine are over 166 times higher than those on the surface... :o (there is also plenty of granite on Dartmoor, but not at buckfastleigh!)

Online Cantclimbtom

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #56 on: May 19, 2021, 10:56:49 am »
Counts inside the mine are over 166 times higher than those on the surface... :o (there is also plenty of granite on Dartmoor, but not at buckfastleigh!)
That could be a seed for a new thread. "Drinking Buckfast Tonic Underground", maybe we'd get a few Scots contributing on that one? ;)

Why are you reading my reply here, you got a problem with it, eh? eh?  what "the hell are you looking at"? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buckfast_Tonic_Wine#Antisocial_image
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Offline rhychydwr1

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #57 on: May 19, 2021, 11:35:11 am »
Buckfast Abbey next door to Devon's top caving area Buckfastleigh.  What is the world coming to?

Offline Flotsam

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #58 on: May 19, 2021, 11:50:01 am »
I've theorised that the months/years spent digging at the high Radon bottom of Nettle Pot combined with his smoking is what caused Frank Brown's lung cancer.

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #59 on: May 19, 2021, 11:50:21 am »
Now you definitely woudn't want to smoke in Kingswood Mine, Devon - or probably even enter it.

There's Terras Mine too, that's one you definitely don't want to enter...
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Online mikem

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #60 on: May 19, 2021, 12:04:20 pm »
mindat (radioactivity counts are about the same in both):
Quote
Whilst uranium ores had been found in other Cornish mines occurrence was sporadic. South Terras was unique in Cornwall in that a lode of some 250 fathoms length (457.2m) was found with uranium derivatives being the principal ores (taken from the Journal of the Royal Institution of Cornwall Vol. 1, 1993).

Offline 2xw

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #61 on: May 19, 2021, 12:59:11 pm »
You'd never be able to seperate it from the potentially high radon in Derbyshire houses, 30% of which have too high radon anyways. I worked out the time in giants versus time in my house in terms of radon exposure and it's not /that/ unfavourable tbh. Maybe I should start smoking down there

Offline Paul Marvin

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #62 on: May 19, 2021, 05:27:47 pm »
Granite ge

Granite generally contains more radon than limestone (so avoid Edinburgh & Cornwall...)
nerally contains more radon than limestone (so avoid Edinburgh & Cornwall...)

We have both in Derbyshire dependent on which part, that is why (I been told that ) we have the The White Peak and The Dark Peak areas of the Peak District. Today's trivia is " why is it called the "Peak District" and its not the obvious ?
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Offline pwhole

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #63 on: May 19, 2021, 05:45:41 pm »
I've theorised that the months/years spent digging at the high Radon bottom of Nettle Pot combined with his smoking is what caused Frank Brown's lung cancer.

The only time I went to the bottom of Nettle, the CO2 levels were so high we could barely breathe, and we had to prussik straight back up again - 50m just to the main bedding, where it was tolerable, but still very high. That was the worst climb I've ever done, and I had to leave my mate at the bottom slowly suffocating whilst I tried to go as quickly as I could, which wasn't very quick, and I was gasping for the entire pitch. We measured it a fortnight or so later and I think it was 2.6% - manageable on an easy stroll in Water Icicle, but definitely not SRT. I don't know how FB managed digging down there - I know it varies, but it's always obviously high - which just reminded me of the original topic.

And no comments on the alcohol report then?  :smartass:

Online mikem

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #64 on: May 19, 2021, 06:06:31 pm »
Smoking does increase your tolerance to CO2.

Offline Flotsam

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #65 on: May 19, 2021, 06:13:20 pm »
I've theorised that the months/years spent digging at the high Radon bottom of Nettle Pot combined with his smoking is what caused Frank Brown's lung cancer.

The only time I went to the bottom of Nettle, the CO2 levels were so high we could barely breathe, and we had to prussik straight back up again - 50m just to the main bedding, where it was tolerable, but still very high. That was the worst climb I've ever done, and I had to leave my mate at the bottom slowly suffocating whilst I tried to go as quickly as I could, which wasn't very quick, and I was gasping for the entire pitch. We measured it a fortnight or so later and I think it was 2.6% - manageable on an easy stroll in Water Icicle, but definitely not SRT. I don't know how FB managed digging down there - I know it varies, but it's always obviously high - which just reminded me of the original topic.

And no comments on the alcohol report then?  :smartass:
The CO2 wouldn't have bothered Frank he had the essential spliff going. Mind you oxygen was needed to keep the joint going.

Offline Boy Engineer

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #66 on: May 19, 2021, 06:26:08 pm »
Quote
And this just in - ohohoh. I look forward to comments tomorrow evening, but it's past my bedtime :)

Here you go. Having spent much of today casking 1200 litres of beer and then cleaning a fermenter, it’s not the consumption that I’m worried about, but the knackering effect (on me) of brewing. I’m probably physically fitter than I’ve ever been, but mentally exhausted after the last year. Holding out for a peer-review from a cask ale fan.

Offline pwhole

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #67 on: May 19, 2021, 06:46:40 pm »
The CO2 wouldn't have bothered Frank he had the essential spliff going. Mind you oxygen was needed to keep the joint going.

He seems like the kind of guy to take an oxygen generator down, just for that purpose. He sounds like me, basically - wish I could have met him, but I wasn't caving then - well, at least not 'properly' :)

Online Cantclimbtom

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #68 on: May 19, 2021, 07:15:42 pm »
Rusophycus and Pecsætan -- Two things I've learned today from you folks at "Adit-ukcaving". But, will I still remember any of it tomorrow?

Wait a minute.. Googled some more, that's a sneaky trick Paul. A double bluff.
It *is* named after what I had assumed just indirectly because of what Pecsætan means!
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Offline EFRESHW

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #69 on: May 20, 2021, 06:34:55 am »
This is an interesting topic and I wanted to add my 2 cents as a self-proclaimed 'connoisseur'.

On face value, (much like the rest of society who deems alcohol more acceptable), I find it interesting how being incredibly intoxicated the night before, and having a 'hang over' is decided as 'part of the fun of the sport', whilst perhaps a small micro-dose of cannabis would be considered innapropriate.

What hasn't been mentioned is the % of THC and CBD here. I believe that people with anxiety would actually BENEFIT from a few tokes (MICRODOSE, literally maybe even one puff) of a high CBD and low THC strain before caving. Obviously, this needs to come with prior experimentation on a very personal level. I would never suggest to dose something you havn't already tried out in the past. (AKA: find the right strain for you which you know will calm you down, and make you BETTER and more focused when caving, not something that will drain you out!) I'd also like to point out that you should know what you're taking, (TEST IT! is it laced? Where does it come from? Who grew it? What strain is it?) and TELL YOUR FRIENDS before going in. Also, is this a cave you're comfortable with? its best to pick somewhere you already feel comfortable with and you have done before. This is just what I'd do if I decided to smoke before going under. Legal or not, know what you're taking and the situation you're going into.

I have never done this, but I can see that with the right strain, it would be something excellent for me to do perhaps half an hour/ an hour before caving. It would probably make me a better communicator with my mates about my fears underground and make me feel genuinely better at being with the feeling of being scared.

Bringing it back to alcohol, I've found it VERY uncomfortable in the past how this is seen as 'fine'. Many cavers I've known have gone caving with less than 4 hrs of sleep and a hangover. That completely throws me and I find a sleep-deprived, hungover caver, a dangerous one.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2021, 06:46:16 am by EFRESHW »

Online Cantclimbtom

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #70 on: May 20, 2021, 02:15:44 pm »
We have to avoid arguments based on:  doing X is OK because look at those people they do something worse
Or the other issue is arguments based on, someone does X but they feel fine so it's OK.
We need objective data and the only way we can get any sort of meaningful data is from standardised testing

I propose we take a large group of cavers and mine explorers and randomly allocate them into 3 groups
1) Massively hungover (sponsorship opportunity)
2) Heavy "smoking"
3) Control group. But to counteract https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_effect, the control group needs to feel like they're truly participating, perhaps sponsorship opportunity with Volvic/Evian to provide them "Alcohol free Vodka" so they don't realise they've been placed in the control group

A suitable through trip venue found involving sections of SRT etc, carbon dioxide pockets, "Jenga" (crawling between rotten stemples) and "minefield" (ancient blasting caps on floor). A team of beaters drive subjects in one end of the trip and using chip times we can see how quickly each breaks cover at the other end and in what condition.

I'm sure Sheffield Hallam University has found funding for far less worthy and obscure studies in the past and let's face "Deep Time" got funding for some French people to sit round a large folding table underground for 40 days. So I'd be pretty confident that this could attract funding, sponsorship if correctly exploited and probably run at a profit.

This is the only objective way to settle this thread and I'd expect the BCA to jump on this one as a priority.
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Offline sinker

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #71 on: May 20, 2021, 02:53:34 pm »

We have to avoid arguments based on:  doing X is OK because look at those people they do something worse


This thread is going a long way towards confirming that there is nothing more boring in life than a "pro-weed" advocate. All the science and pseudo-science and the endless comparisons with alcohol....yawn.

I'm sure alcohol is much more widely used and therefore abused and therefore wrecks many more lives than weed but trying to pass weed off as the clever, intelligent, mis-understood alternative is just naïve. It just messes your head up in a different way.

Ah, well, now, you see...erm...

Offline JoshW

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #72 on: May 20, 2021, 04:09:49 pm »

This thread is going a long way towards confirming that there is nothing more boring in life than a "pro-weed" advocate.

My biggest argument for legalising weed for a long time (got better things to argue about now) was that it would shut up the pro-weed advocates, which has to be seen as a benefit for all!
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Offline pwhole

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #73 on: May 20, 2021, 05:13:54 pm »

This is the only objective way to settle this thread and I'd expect the BCA to jump on this one as a priority.

Fabulous - put me on the list :)

Offline pwhole

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Re: Smoking Weed Underground
« Reply #74 on: May 20, 2021, 05:22:00 pm »
It just messes your head up in a different way.

Yes, but it's a way that you can still do useful things on it, unlike alcohol. I accept that alcohol's pretty good to 'get the party started', but it tends to be all downhill from there, and you definitely have to go to sleep to wipe it out. You can't get pissed in the afternoon and expect to have a productive evening. I'm a pretty busy chap, and it's never stopped me doing anything, nor degraded my performance either. Or if it has, I'd only be better than I am now, but I'm quite happy 'as is'.

EFRESHW's comments about THC/CBD are also extremely relevant, but I'm not going to post any science links, don't worry ;)

 

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