Caves on Foel Fraith

[WillDeBeast]

Technology never has, and never will be able to compensate for human error. Rubbish in = rubbish out. 

I dont know, with the rapid advancement in AI, I think saying never might be a little optimistic  :-\

 

[rhychydwr1]

There is another book, with a better description 

 

[Andy Sparrow]

Saturday 7th July
Ogof Pwll Swnd
Andy, Rachel, Neil, Judi and Megan
Caves of South Wales says OPS is not difficult to find and has a cairn at the entrance.  Neither statement is correct.  Actually we didn't too bad considering we found the cave within about thirty minutes or arriving in the  approximate location zone but, be warned, it's one very small entrance in one very big moor.  We only had time to visit the 'old' series but found it quite pleasant and worthwhile.  The passages are mostly quite spacious and pleasantly decorated in places.  We left the '71 extensions for another time after 2 hours in the cave.  The view across the Black Mountain from the entrance has got to be one of the wildest and most panoramic that any UK entrance can offer.  We enjoyed the walks, both ways, taking only an hour to get back.  A very pleasant day on and under the finest wilderness in S Wales.

Hey, that was our trip!  I'm not going to comment on the other points and accusations but I will add, perhaps rather ironically, that we DID find Ogof Dan-y-Lleuad (at least we think so) accidentally while walking back!

 

[ChrisJC]

Just one thought - with such a disparate group of people from all over the country, and none actually having been to this cave before, I assume you all accepted that there was a risk that you would not find the cave given its wild location?

Oh, absolutely. If it had been hissing down, we'd have done the Ogof Pasg - Ogof Foel Fawr through trip as we know where the entrance was.

But we thought, hey, it's a nice day for a stroll, let's give it a try. If we completely fail, at least we've had a nice walk. We did find something, just not what we were looking for, I got a sunburned chest (doesn't happen often on caving trips), and we all had a good chinwag.

The only drawback was not finding the actual cave we were looking for, hence this thread to redress the balance for next time. :-\

Chris.

 

[ChrisJC]

There is another book, with a better description 

Come on, what be that then?

 

[rhychydwr1]

There is another book, with a better description   

Come on, what be that then?

Sorry, I am not allowed to advertise my books on this list   
 

 

[Peter Burgess]

There is nothing to stop me doing it for you though. 
http://www.sat.dundee.ac.uk/arb/speleo/guides.html
I suspect the book referred to is here somewhere.

Seriously, if someone asks you 'what book?' I can't see why you shouldn't be able to tell us.

I think it was the almost unsolicited advertising that annoyed some people.

 

[WillDeBeast]

There is another book, with a better description   

It was using this other book which aided us in not finding the cave 
Having one set of co-ords on the survey and a completely different set on the description doesnt really help much either 

 

[ChrisJC]

Sorry, I am not allowed to advertise my books on this list   
 

B*gger, I'm being obtuse  :-\ I realised who you were this morning... 

Then I thought :idea:, hey, I could send Tony a PM - and, guess what was waiting for me this afternoon......

Chris.

 

[cap n chris]

guess what was waiting for me this afternoon......

.... er, a PM from NigR containing an up-to-the-minute and highly accurate ten digit grid reference for your preferred destination?

 

[ChrisJC]

guess what was waiting for me this afternoon......

.... er, a PM from NigR containing an up-to-the-minute and highly accurate ten digit grid reference for your preferred destination?

I wish!

 

[graham]

I have just read this thread for the first time and it's absobloodylutely hilarious.

I will make just one comment; giving a grid reference to 10 figures makes a statement about the precision of the measurement, it says nothing (obviously ) about its accuracy.

 

[Peter Burgess]

I have just read this thread for the first time and it's absobloodylutely hilarious.

I will make just one comment; giving a grid reference to 10 figures makes a statement about the precision of the measurement, it says nothing (obviously ) about its accuracy.

Precisely.

 

[WillDeBeast]

... makes a statement about the precision of the measurement, it says nothing (obviously ) about its accuracy.

:read: Precise  adj. exact, accurate in every detail ...-precision n.

:read: Accurate adj. exact, correct. ...-accuracy n.

Can you really have precision without accuracy? not if you go by the dictionary definition, if its not accurate it can not be precise 

PS i'm glad our misery has entertained you 

 

[cap n chris]

i'm glad our misery has entertained you

Anyone who can't derive great enjoyment from others' misery isn't really suitable for caving. It's pretty much the sole reason for doing this madness.

 

[WillDeBeast]

Anyone who can't derive great enjoyment from others' misery isn't really suitable for caving. It's pretty much the sole reason for doing this madness.

Too true 

 

[graham]

... makes a statement about the precision of the measurement, it says nothing (obviously ) about its accuracy.

:read: Precise  adj. exact, accurate in every detail ...-precision n.

:read: Accurate adj. exact, correct. ...-accuracy n.

Can you really have precision without accuracy? not if you go by the dictionary definition, if its not accurate it can not be precise   

PS i'm glad our misery has entertained you   

Sod the dictionary, it is neither precise nor accurate.  :blink:

The difference is this: Precision refers to the spread, thus a 10 figure grid reference is more precise than an eight figure one. Accuracy, however, relates to how close the stated figure is to the "real one". The figures you were given had a well-defined degree of precision, but none of them were bloody accurate, evidently.

T'was not your misery that entertained me, but its aftermath. I am particularly taken by the use of the word Dribble. Most erudite, I feel.

 

[cap n chris]

I thought it was a pseudo-malapropistic version of drivel, mesel'.

 

[graham]

I thought it was a pseudo-malapropistic version of drivel, mesel'.

Why aren't you out caving?

 

[cap n chris]

Got ten minutes to spare; off now!....

Report later!