royfellows
Well-known member
PeteHall said:
Rats are rats, and good riddance. If you like shooting them, enjoy.
Has to be an exception to my dislike of killing animals just for fun
Anyone bring foxes into it, I think I stay out.
Dead birds filmed being thrown into a shaft
- Thread starter royfellows
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Rats are rats, and good riddance. If you like shooting them, enjoy.
Has to be an exception to my dislike of killing animals just for fun
Anyone bring foxes into it, I think I stay out.
But even conservationists agree that foxes need to be controlled (& other predators, because we've created an environment where they aren't naturally):
https://community.rspb.org.uk/ourwork/b/martinharper/posts/the-conservationist-39-s-dilemma-an-update-on-the-science-policy-and-practice-of-the-impact-of-predators-on-wild-birds-5
https://community.rspb.org.uk/ourwork/b/martinharper/posts/the-conservationist-39-s-dilemma-an-update-on-the-science-policy-and-practice-of-the-impact-of-predators-on-wild-birds-5
andrewmcleod
Well-known member
You can reduce fox numbers in a small area by effective methods of culling, but nationally far more get killed on the roads every year (orders of magnitudes more). Their population is far more affected, I believe, by food availability (e.g. dead livestock, or dumped dead pheasants perhaps...).
Prancing around chasing foxes on horseback has effectively zero effect on the national population.
Prancing around chasing foxes on horseback has effectively zero effect on the national population.
Cantclimbtom
Well-known member
Maybe if Wolves were widely released, the fox and muntjac levels would reduce. Not sure that "game" bird managers, sheep farmers etc would be quite so keen. Interesting to see how it pans out in the Brecon--Monmouth area. Could keep things interesting. N. Wales is being discussed, not sure which bit and if anything will come of it
Cantclimbtom
Well-known member
These days everything is about backside covering and who is liable - who can claim. If a lamb was eaten, who pays for it etc etc. I think that's the insurmountable hurdle, or they'd have been re-introduced already. Beavers on the other hand...mikem said:
2xw
Active member
Cantclimbtom said:
If you do some back of the envelope calculations looking at normal wolf population density and their kill rate, you could pretty much get them at their max density in the UK and they wouldn't even kill a quarter of the deer that are already killed. Realistically the deer problem needs to be solved with hunting rights democratisation a la Norway but not sure the estates will be into that.
Deer control is a much posited benefit of reintroducing large predators but it doesn't stand up to real scrutiny in my humble opinion (not that that discounts the idea entirely!)
PeteHall
Moderator
pwhole said:It would be about time, IMO. Thinning the herd can be beneficial to overall standards, as has been observed. And it should lower obesity rates from the more regular exercise
If I'm reading that right and you are suggesting "thinning the herd" of humans, perhaps an easier option would have been to have let natural selection take its course over covid and forgone all the lockdowns, vaccines and everything else we have been subjected to for the last couple of years. After all, covid mostly affected the overweight and elderly.
In fact doing away with the NHS altogether would also help in this regard and also save a lot of money, so that the healthy could enjoy a happier life.
Though if I remember rightly, you have been a vocal supporter of vaccines, lockdowns an the NHS more generally?
Either way, advocating the introduction of predators to "thin the human herd" is beyond ridiculous, so perhaps I have misinterpreted you?
Cantclimbtom
Well-known member
It's difficult in online posts as you have no tone of voice etc and we can get misunderstandings. FWIW my suggestion backing Wolf rewilding was also tongue in cheek. I didn't go as far as to link it to the obesity epidemic, people's running speed, or thinning the herd etc I was certainly also thinking that as I'd typed my posts
Please assume anything I type is nonsense, based on a mixture of widespread irreverence, an inflammatory sense of humour and complete incompetence. Whether it excuses it or not, if I suggest something that causes offense that's due to me being tactless and vulgar, but guaranteed never maliciously intended.
To be clear: No I don't really think Wolves re-wilding in Wales is a brilliant and entirely consequence free idea
Please assume anything I type is nonsense, based on a mixture of widespread irreverence, an inflammatory sense of humour and complete incompetence. Whether it excuses it or not, if I suggest something that causes offense that's due to me being tactless and vulgar, but guaranteed never maliciously intended.
To be clear: No I don't really think Wolves re-wilding in Wales is a brilliant and entirely consequence free idea
royfellows
Well-known member
One thing (amongst others) that I like about Chris J C is that he usually talks plain common sense with absolutely no regard at all for "trends" or "fashionable opinion".
ChrisJC
Well-known member
mikem said:
Yes, I thought that when I wrote the post above. We have tried (as a society) a few times to deal with it, but some people are just determined to have dogs with a propensity for fatal violence. I'm not sure what else could be done, apart from maybe just completely ban some breeds.
I suspect that in general we as a society 'accept' the deaths caused by dogs as part of being in general accepting of dogs.
I am not sure we'd be so accepting of foxes behaving in the same way, 'natural' or not! I don't know, so we will have to wait until we get a spate of starving foxes attacking babies one hot London summer...
Chris.
RobinGriffiths
Well-known member
An interesting article here. No idea how representative of the situation it is, but it gives some insight.
https://thecitro.substack.com/p/hunt-sabs-and-hare-coursers
https://thecitro.substack.com/p/hunt-sabs-and-hare-coursers
Speleofish
Active member
In response to ChrisJC. According to hospital statistics in 2016, labradors bite more people than any other breed in the UK. I haven't seen a more recent update (which surprised me...).
Cantclimbtom
Well-known member
apparently in 2021 the most common dog breed was "mixed" so that doesn't count, but the second on the list was Labrador (https://www.lifetimepetcover.co.uk/pet-advice/news/2021s-most-popular-dog-breeds-in-the-uk/) so it could be that there are just many more Labradors out there?
