Draenen : Big Bang Pitch
- Thread starter Alkapton
- Start date
Reminds me of the fixed ropes in Cwmystwyth Mines installed by the old North Cardiganshire Mining Club in the 1970s - they reportedly 'obtained' them from fishing boats in Aberystwyth harbour. There were some still in place underground into the 1990s...
One was repeatedly damaged by rockfall and acquired a middle section that was a series of knots and long wispy ends where it had come unlaid. Last time I saw it, the upper half and a lot of mid way crocheting was 1970s vintage ex-fishing boat, and the lower half was early 1980s polypropylene hawser laid bargain-basement rubbish.
One was repeatedly damaged by rockfall and acquired a middle section that was a series of knots and long wispy ends where it had come unlaid. Last time I saw it, the upper half and a lot of mid way crocheting was 1970s vintage ex-fishing boat, and the lower half was early 1980s polypropylene hawser laid bargain-basement rubbish.
I suppose leaving your own gear rigged in a cave is generally frowned upon.
There is a disclaimer in the access regs stating which aids are approved and checked. Anything else is used at your own risk.
If you're going to do it, don't tell anyone - oops, too late. Just leave the gear for a short period -a few weeks or couple of months. Leaving your gear in a cave isn't good for it. It's much better to take it out, wash it and store it properly.
Like Nig, I'd be interested to know why you'd like to do this. People sometimes leave things rigged on remote pitches while they are pursuing a project. Big Bang pitch is near the entrance and has an easy bypass.
There is a disclaimer in the access regs stating which aids are approved and checked. Anything else is used at your own risk.
If you're going to do it, don't tell anyone - oops, too late. Just leave the gear for a short period -a few weeks or couple of months. Leaving your gear in a cave isn't good for it. It's much better to take it out, wash it and store it properly.
Like Nig, I'd be interested to know why you'd like to do this. People sometimes leave things rigged on remote pitches while they are pursuing a project. Big Bang pitch is near the entrance and has an easy bypass.
Alkapton
Member
ummmm,
Can I guarantee its safety? Once I take my eyes off it no. Just decent rope on mallon, if I am happy to use it then its safe.
Why do it? i) I love pitches but I hate dragging ropes. ii) I know a great many ropes going to waste and unused. iii) Having read a description of this pitch I'm not certain I can/dare rig it, de-rigging more scarey than rigging so brown pants are inevitable. iv) I have a feeling without having looked at Darling rifts I'll prefer coming out that way than the bypass.
What I don't understand (I have not yet seen Big Bang so going on description - but this is true of other pitches) is why people who install hangers do not put a hanger in a nice safe unscarey place so one can secure oneself to a rope before one is forced into leaning too far out over a chasm of certain death. I'm not scared of heights as such but I'm petrifiied of edges It is possible for me to freeze and backing off such a place takes a long time which is very unpleasant.
I addmitt I've probably got strange ideas in my head (even for a caver) but thats mostly because I have to figure this stuff out on me own, I'm lazy and probably I'll be in the cave a lot so it makes sense to me.
Can I guarantee its safety? Once I take my eyes off it no. Just decent rope on mallon, if I am happy to use it then its safe.
Why do it? i) I love pitches but I hate dragging ropes. ii) I know a great many ropes going to waste and unused. iii) Having read a description of this pitch I'm not certain I can/dare rig it, de-rigging more scarey than rigging so brown pants are inevitable. iv) I have a feeling without having looked at Darling rifts I'll prefer coming out that way than the bypass.
What I don't understand (I have not yet seen Big Bang so going on description - but this is true of other pitches) is why people who install hangers do not put a hanger in a nice safe unscarey place so one can secure oneself to a rope before one is forced into leaning too far out over a chasm of certain death. I'm not scared of heights as such but I'm petrifiied of edges It is possible for me to freeze and backing off such a place takes a long time which is very unpleasant.
I addmitt I've probably got strange ideas in my head (even for a caver) but thats mostly because I have to figure this stuff out on me own, I'm lazy and probably I'll be in the cave a lot so it makes sense to me.
Big Bang Pitch was first rigged (in a hurry) for ladder and line for it's original descent. Later a couple of bolts were placed (very high up) for a rescue practice. Bolts have never been placed for SRT as it's not a trade route. It's not a place to play SRTing.
I don't think you've understood what Graham and Nig are getting at.
I don't like being negative but :
You don't seem to have a clue.
See my response above.
The phrase that keeps popping into my head when I read your postings is "Accident waiting to happen"
I hope this doesn't mean there'll soon be dodgy fixed ropes all over South East Wales.
Please join a club and go caving with more experienced people. If you already belong to a club then please talk to the other members and get them to take you under their wing. This is meant as genuine advice.
Alkapton said:
I don't think you've understood what Graham and Nig are getting at.
I don't like being negative but :
Alkapton said:
You don't seem to have a clue.
Alkapton said:
See my response above.
Alkapton said:
The phrase that keeps popping into my head when I read your postings is "Accident waiting to happen"
Alkapton said:
I hope this doesn't mean there'll soon be dodgy fixed ropes all over South East Wales.
Please join a club and go caving with more experienced people. If you already belong to a club then please talk to the other members and get them to take you under their wing. This is meant as genuine advice.
Alkapton said:
Alkapton said:
With the greatest respect I think you probably need a bit more practice. Derigging shouldn't be scarier than rigging and bolts generally aren't placed so you have to "lean too far out over a chasm of certain death". In fact you rarely need to "lean out" at all, but rather walk back with your weight on your well-rigged and backed-up rope.
If you would like SRT to become safe and unscary, then talk to your club about some training (and if they can't provide it, look for someone who can). I promise it'll open up a whole new world to you.
Oh and finally - Big Bang Pitch is NOT the place to be practising SRT really. It is very loose and good rigging is not immediately obvious unless you are reasonably experienced. There are also lots of dodgy naturals that look alright to an inexperienced eye. I would strongly suggest that the normal climb bypass is much less effort!
"why people who install hangers do not put a hanger in a nice safe unscarey place so one can secure oneself to a rope before one is forced into leaning too far out over a chasm of certain death"
That because bods who rig pitches are all 6'6" and those of us who come after them are a foot shorter!
That because bods who rig pitches are all 6'6" and those of us who come after them are a foot shorter!
Broken Chris
Member
With all due respect, I get the distinct impression that it doesn't matter what advice (direct, indirect, friendly or otherwise) people on this list will give you that you'll still put the ropes there regardless. Surely the general sentiment on leaving used kit and the advice behind your stated reasons why you want it there were more than covered in your last post on Draenen? Which makes me wonder why start this new thread?
I don't like being a downer, but as far as I can see the best advice that's been offered - join a club who can help you develop your caving technique seems to have fallen on deaf ears.
I don't like being a downer, but as far as I can see the best advice that's been offered - join a club who can help you develop your caving technique seems to have fallen on deaf ears.
Alkapton
Member
Well however controversial I might seem, I got to the top of Big Bang and guess what....
It was already rigged. There is no possible way I can reach the hanger so its clear I didn't rig it! But I now know how to rig it using boulders and inner tube sheaths to protect rope.
I check length of rope in place - nowhere near 20 meters, so I rigged my rope and then found the pitch is somewhat shorter than 20 meters and I needn't have bothered.
So that trip was Darling Rifts in Spare Rib out. Next trip is Spare Rib in Big Bang Out.
To anyone wanting to do Big Bang I say this - As long as you protect your rope adequately, ie with inner tubes or similar, it is perfectly possible to rig to boulders but in this case you will want a 20 meter rope. It is a very very nice pitch.
It was already rigged. There is no possible way I can reach the hanger so its clear I didn't rig it! But I now know how to rig it using boulders and inner tube sheaths to protect rope.
I check length of rope in place - nowhere near 20 meters, so I rigged my rope and then found the pitch is somewhat shorter than 20 meters and I needn't have bothered.
So that trip was Darling Rifts in Spare Rib out. Next trip is Spare Rib in Big Bang Out.
To anyone wanting to do Big Bang I say this - As long as you protect your rope adequately, ie with inner tubes or similar, it is perfectly possible to rig to boulders but in this case you will want a 20 meter rope. It is a very very nice pitch.
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