Poll

Under what circumstances is it OK to go caving now?

Not at all.
With members of your household and trips are well within own ability.
So long as social distancing is respected and trips are well within own ability.
So long as social distancing is respected.
Any time, anywhere.

Author Topic: Is it OK to go caving?  (Read 18523 times)

Online Mark Wright

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #125 on: May 25, 2020, 12:43:10 am »

Personally, I see no reason not to do some caving provided
a) it's a small party, travelling separately, going back home afterwards 
b) it avoids challenging trips, thereby reducing the already small chance of needing rescue to (virtually) zero
c) it avoids parking in a village or walking past a farmhouse to get to,
d) preferably in the evening for increased discretion

- all of which cuts down the options, but surely leaves some chances for responsible caving?

The climbing operation John Allen was carrying out earlier this week just prior to his tragic death was what most climbers would consider to be a normal operation. He was rigging a simple 'ab-off'. I worked with John for a good few years and he was very competent with his rope work. In caving terms I suppose the operation was nothing more complex than rigging ropes etc. to go down P8 or Giants.

When you haven't been doing your chosen pastime for a while you'd be surprised how easy it is to forget something and in John's case, with catastrophic consequences.

I was a bit wary when I went out on my motorbike for the first time a week or so ago.

The BHPA always have safety articles in their magazine warning of the dangers of rushing into the summer thermals after a long winter of no flying. Many of the accident and near miss reports in the summer edition of Skywings relate to people making basic mistakes early in the season. The main mistake is usually taking off in the first place. Better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air than being in the air and wishing you were on the ground. I've been there a couple of times. There was a lone hang glider on Bradwell Edge for a couple of hours on Tuesday.

Just be extra extra careful.

Mark

Offline mikem

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #126 on: May 25, 2020, 06:14:02 am »
A high percentage of climbing accidents, involving experienced participants, are on relatively easy ground, or abseiling, either because they are tired, or not concentrating. Be careful out there!

Offline Ed

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #127 on: May 25, 2020, 10:52:08 am »
Guess we can go to the Co. Durham caves now - upper Teesdale (northern Bank) and Weardale

Offline pwhole

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #128 on: May 25, 2020, 11:52:51 am »
This just in:

https://www.thewestonmercury.co.uk/news/outbreak-of-coronavirus-at-weston-general-hospital-1-6669079

Quote
The decision to take this step has been clinically-led, and is supported by partners across the wider Bristol, North Somerset and South Gloucestershire (BNSSG) health and care system.

Dr William Oldfield, medical director at UHBW, said: “As with any hospital, the number of patients with Covid-19 will frequently change as people are admitted and discharged.

“We currently have a high number of patients with Covid-19 in Weston General Hospital.

“Whilst the vast majority will have come into the hospital with Covid-19, as an extra precaution we have taken the proactive step to temporarily stop accepting new patients to maintain patient and staff safety.

Offline mikem

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #129 on: May 25, 2020, 12:57:17 pm »
Their A&E department never recovered from the problems that have caused it to be shut down overnight since 2017.

Offline pwhole

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #130 on: May 25, 2020, 01:39:31 pm »
Indeed - but if this spike is shown to be from last weekend's beach revelries, then it would seem to suggest that the likelihood of infection outdoors is much higher in large groups - and that another lockdown may result, rather than a further loosening. It also seems from what I'm hearing that some climbing venues around here are pretty busy, with some camping overnight to get the best spot in the morning, which hardly seems to be following the spirit of the guidance, especially if folk are sharing tents. I'd love to check, but I'm still trying to observe the travel restrictions for non-drivers and non-cyclists - i.e. no travel at all for fun, except walking. But at least I'm clean, both physically and spiritually. Unlike some of our 'betters'. Johnson looks like he hasn't slept in a week. Good.

Online Fjell

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #131 on: May 25, 2020, 02:03:09 pm »
8 million kids are going back to school soon, because there is no alternative. That will dwarf any Impact from running around outside. You cannot screw up these kids lives to save the old folks. People will just have to suck it up and do better managing it.
.

Offline mikem

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #132 on: May 25, 2020, 02:47:24 pm »
As testing is finally catching up, it's more likely that they've just discovered that it spreads through hospitals just as easily as it did care homes, rather than these being new admissions.

Offline The Old Ruminator

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #133 on: May 25, 2020, 06:05:45 pm »
Just back from Bristol on the motorway. About 15 high powered racing cars hurtled past at a huge speed. I was doing 80. Ruddy free for all on motorways now. I am not sure Weston hospital closed due to a " spike " in cases. Just that numbers of patients with possible or more minor symptoms built up to a level the hospital felt better not to admit any more. As far as I know nearby Taunton still has plenty of capacity. I have seen all the current graphs etc for Somerset. Our mortality rate is %2 above the previous 5 year average.

Offline mikem

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #134 on: May 25, 2020, 06:20:54 pm »
Is that for May, first 5 months, or whole year?

Offline The Old Ruminator

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #135 on: May 25, 2020, 07:28:47 pm »
Figures quoted are from 20th March to 5th May, Mike. %2 above the normal rate across that timescale.

Online Duck ditch

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #136 on: May 25, 2020, 07:37:39 pm »
Go caving fjell.  Before you lose any more of your moral integrity.  Let the old people and everybody who’s dealing with this virus suck it up for you. Thanks for your 9 weeks of patience well done. 

Offline The Old Ruminator

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #137 on: May 25, 2020, 07:38:27 pm »
Darn. Still no mention of Caving Club Huts today.

"  “But because of the progress we are making I can, with confidence, put the British people on notice of the changes we intend to introduce as we move to step two.”

From June 1, outdoor markets and car showrooms will be allowed to open, provided they can do so safely.

He said: “We know that the transmission of the virus is lower outdoors and that it is easier to follow Covid secure guidelines in open spaces.”

From June 15, “all other non-essential retail” will be allowed to reopen, contingent on progress in the fight against coronavirus and if the businesses are “Covid secure”.

Online Fjell

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #138 on: May 25, 2020, 07:57:16 pm »
Go caving fjell.  Before you lose any more of your moral integrity.  Let the old people and everybody who’s dealing with this virus suck it up for you. Thanks for your 9 weeks of patience well done.
I have kids at uni (which includes medical placements) and kids waiting to go back to school. We have 4 parents in their 80’s and 90’s who will very likely to die if they get it. All of which we are holding up and managing. I might even die of it, which will be an organisational issue for sure.
The point is we need to move on and stop wittering about non-issues. There is a risk of is dying of it, but so what. Caving is very light relief from reality.

Online Duck ditch

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #139 on: May 25, 2020, 09:30:40 pm »
You have more reasons to be patient than me fjell.  Maybe we as a country have done enough.  Hope so. 

Offline kay

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #140 on: May 26, 2020, 09:23:59 am »
You cannot screw up these kids lives to save the old folks.
.

I thought the reason for lockdown was to spread the load on the NHS and make sure it was still available for anyone who needed it, of any age? Not simply to save old folks.`

If they'd wanted to save the old folks, you'd have thought they'd have been a bit more effective at stopping it spreading in care homes and nursing homes.

One of the depressing things of the current situation is the number of people on social media who seem to regard the lives of the elderly as unimportant, and think that everyone vulnerable to Covid was going to die in the next 6 months anyway.

Offline Fulk

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #141 on: May 26, 2020, 10:34:06 am »
Miranda and I are planning on doing Black Shiver tomorrow (probably on ladders), since we're 'special people' and 'the rules don't apply to us'.

Offline RobinGriffiths

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #142 on: May 26, 2020, 10:55:34 am »
Clap for Cummings.

Offline Pitlamp

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #143 on: May 26, 2020, 11:00:27 am »
Certainly will, if he does the decent thing.

Offline pwhole

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #144 on: May 26, 2020, 12:25:41 pm »
There's a bitter irony at the moment, as Southend tourist board issue their latest travel advice (video), which, notably doesn't include 'Stay Alert':

https://www.visitsouthend.co.uk/

Hilariously, the Southend Echo used drone footage to 'prove' that all the visitors were socially-distancing - with a nice little promo nod to his mate at the drone company. But not really backing up the tourist board's advice:

https://www.echo-news.co.uk/news/18473844.drone-pictures-show-people-social-distancing-southend-seafront/

Hardly any toilets open, so are they all shitting and pissing in the sea? Or in the sand? Rescue teams were active on several locations around the south coast, pulling folks from the water or thick mud. It really is like 'Jaws', except thankfully the mayor is on the other side of the argument this time.

Frankly, even if there were no coronavirus, this looks like pure hell to me, and if that's what a sizeable chunk of the British public think is entertainment, then they're welcome to it. I really would rather be sat in the woods on my own than that.

Offline royfellows

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #145 on: May 26, 2020, 12:57:13 pm »
I cant help thinking that with Wales being closed to visitors by Welsh Government this is throwing extra burden on England?
My avatar is a poor likeness.

Offline Ian P

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #146 on: May 26, 2020, 01:51:57 pm »
We passed through Threshfield Quarry yesterday afternoon on a walk.
The top pool (blue lagoon) was like something from Benidorm at its worst.

Over a Thousand people in large groups, BBQs lots of beer and associated music.

I made some small talk with a young couple who told me it had been trending on Instagram and that it couldn’t be Policed.

Where theres a will and all that.

There was 2 police vans at the bottom but they were just stopping anyone else parking on the access lane.

I dread to think of the litter  :(

Should we go caving ?  With thought and respect: absolutely

Offline pwhole

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #147 on: May 26, 2020, 01:54:05 pm »
The great Science V Politics debate - sound familiar?  :halo:


Offline mikem

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #148 on: May 26, 2020, 02:29:59 pm »
I cant help thinking that with Wales being closed to visitors by Welsh Government this is throwing extra burden on England?
To be fair it's the fact that all shops, pubs, clubs, holiday venues & most visitor attractions have been closed by OUR government (if they were allowing their constituents to come over here, that would a different matter)

Offline royfellows

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Re: Is it OK to go caving?
« Reply #149 on: May 26, 2020, 03:31:30 pm »
The great Science V Politics debate - sound familiar?  :halo:


His choice of cloths speaks volumes. I wonder about his tailor.
 :lol:
My avatar is a poor likeness.

 

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