Author Topic: Ghar Parau, Iran  (Read 6688 times)

Offline thesiger

  • regular
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • ex-owner
Ghar Parau, Iran
« on: March 30, 2010, 05:35:06 am »
An iranian friend has done this cave. She claims that is a pretty big deal. Anyone have any context? Should I be impressed?
« Last Edit: March 30, 2010, 06:48:54 am by thesiger »

Offline Cap'n Chris

  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 12255
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2010, 08:54:54 am »
Never heard of it.  ;)

Offline graham

  • Retired
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 10943
  • UBSS, Speleo-Club de Perigueux, GSG, SUI
    • UBSS
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2010, 09:06:34 am »
To quote Mr Oldham

"There is a book."

Caving is for Life not just for Christmas

Offline rhychydwr1

  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3231
  • The Mayor of Cwm Parc
    • http://www.showcaves.com
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2010, 09:26:51 am »
To quote Mr Oldham

"There is a book."



Graham, you beat me too it   :weep:

Can supply:

GHAR PARAU by D Judson 1973  216 pp 52 photos. HB DW  A British Expedition to a deep pothole in the Kuh-e-Parau massif of Iranian Kurdistan.  £15.00 post free in the UK


Offline thesiger

  • regular
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • ex-owner
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2010, 10:18:50 am »
To quote Mr Oldham
"There is a book."

Yup ... that I know (astonishingly I googled before asking). Would obtaining it answer my question? I am guessing: not.

Offline pete_the_caver

  • menacing presence
  • **
  • Posts: 206
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2010, 10:33:16 am »
how many of us have a soft cover pre-publication edition?

Offline Joel Corrigan

  • obsessive maniac
  • ***
  • Posts: 322
    • Skytek Ltd
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2010, 11:24:49 am »
My memory is appalling but I have a recollection that Ghar Parau has become quite a popular venue for Iranian cavers in the last few years?  I also have a vague idea that there have been a few accidents down there?  When I was caving in NZ I heard of an Iranian caver who was living/working out there who refused to wear a helmet whilst underground because he was too macho!  He was part of an Iranian club that changed activity annually.  For example, one year they'd be cavers, the next year they'd be paddlers, after that they'd be into skiing etc...  I have no idea how many caving clubs there are in Iran but it's quite likely that there may not be much of a breadth of experience there, in which case a trip down Ghar Parau would be a big deal.  But I also imagine that for an experienced alpine caver it would be a bit of a jolly!  I guess it's all down to perspective, background, equipment & techniques. 

I'd say that Simon Brookes may be the chap to answer this thread as he's pretty active in this part of the world.  Few of the original Ghar Parau explorers from the seventies would be able to remember that far back, surely?!   

Offline thesiger

  • regular
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • ex-owner
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2010, 05:06:16 am »
Thanks Joel.

I am a climber so my knowledge of caving is obviously sketchy. What I do know is that Iran is the only country in the Middle East where outdoor sports are really popular with locals, rather than just expats. There are climbers operating at a high level so it's a reasonable inference that there are good cavers too.

Googling Ghar Parau seems to suggest it was one of the world's deepest caves ... not any more I assume?

My friend said the cave still hadn't been done many times, not least because there have been some deaths (from hypothermia I think).

Offline graham

  • Retired
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 10943
  • UBSS, Speleo-Club de Perigueux, GSG, SUI
    • UBSS
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2010, 08:01:59 am »
Thanks Joel.

I am a climber so my knowledge of caving is obviously sketchy. What I do know is that Iran is the only country in the Middle East where outdoor sports are really popular with locals, rather than just expats. There are climbers operating at a high level so it's a reasonable inference that there are good cavers too.

Googling Ghar Parau seems to suggest it was one of the world's deepest caves ... not any more I assume?

My friend said the cave still hadn't been done many times, not least because there have been some deaths (from hypothermia I think).

thesiger

Ghar Parau was once considered as a possibility for a depth record. The first expedition reached -750 m quite quickly at a time when the record was about -1100 m. However, the second expedition only managed to get down one more short pitch and the cave then stopped, effectively. I don't think it has been pushed any deeper since.

Simon Brooks gives a decent potted history here.
Caving is for Life not just for Christmas

Offline SamT

  • Global Moderator
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 6212
    • The Eldon Pothole Club
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2010, 10:30:49 am »
An iranian friend has done this cave. She claims that is a pretty big deal. Anyone have any context? Should I be impressed?


Finally we are getting some decent posts on this topic.

The short answer is "Yes I'd say it was a relatively big deal" though that is dependant on the experience and ability of the participant. She is obviously please with herself about it.

Simon Brooks had the rare opportunity (political relations etc) to visit the cave a few years back. I seem to recall him saying that it was quite an undertaking and actually a relatively arduous trip. a cold wet miserable type trip.  So fair play to her.

Offline oli

  • BEC/AberCC
  • player
  • **
  • Posts: 86
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #10 on: March 31, 2010, 05:42:09 pm »
What I do know is that Iran is the only country in the Middle East where outdoor sports are really popular with locals, rather than just expats.


Dont forget Lebanon and Israel.
disleksix of the world, untie!

Offline thesiger

  • regular
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • ex-owner
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #11 on: April 01, 2010, 07:32:56 am »
What I do know is that Iran is the only country in the Middle East where outdoor sports are really popular with locals, rather than just expats.
Dont forget Lebanon and Israel.
Yes that flashed through my head when I typed the original sentence. I can only pronounce at all authoritatively on climbing:
- Lebanon, yes, locals climb and develop local cliffs
- Israel, yes, locals climb, but there is not much local rock thus staying active requires periodic invasions of Jordan and other neighbours (their national sport ...)

Of course, whether either of those Levant states really count as countries is a moot point. Both are very small ... like, say: Wales. And both are recent creations of bad 20th decision making by (mostly) France, US and the UK. Whilst Iran has been around for millennia.

Offline graham

  • Retired
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 10943
  • UBSS, Speleo-Club de Perigueux, GSG, SUI
    • UBSS
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #12 on: April 01, 2010, 07:38:16 am »
Ooh, ooh! real politics. Careful mate.  ;)
Caving is for Life not just for Christmas

Offline Les W

  • Hard cavin'
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 5270
  • Wessex Cave Club, UCET
    • Wessex Cave Club
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #13 on: April 01, 2010, 09:07:13 am »
Of course, whether either of those Levant states really count as countries is a moot point. Both are very small ... like, say: Wales. And both are recent creations of bad 20th decision making by (mostly) France, US and the UK. Whilst Iran has been around for millennia.

You forgot Belgium.  ;)
I'm a very busy person

Offline graham

  • Retired
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 10943
  • UBSS, Speleo-Club de Perigueux, GSG, SUI
    • UBSS
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #14 on: April 01, 2010, 10:06:24 am »
Of course, whether either of those Levant states really count as countries is a moot point. Both are very small ... like, say: Wales. And both are recent creations of bad 20th decision making by (mostly) France, US and the UK. Whilst Iran has been around for millennia.

You forgot Belgium.  ;)

Belgium was a nineteenth century creation.  :smartass:
Caving is for Life not just for Christmas

Offline Les W

  • Hard cavin'
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 5270
  • Wessex Cave Club, UCET
    • Wessex Cave Club
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #15 on: April 01, 2010, 11:22:56 am »
Of course, whether either of those Levant states really count as countries is a moot point. Both are very small ... like, say: Wales. And both are recent creations of bad 20th decision making by (mostly) France, US and the UK. Whilst Iran has been around for millennia.

You forgot Belgium.  ;)

Belgium was a nineteenth century creation.  :smartass:

Ticks most of the other boxes though.  ;D
I'm a very busy person

Offline oli

  • BEC/AberCC
  • player
  • **
  • Posts: 86
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #16 on: April 01, 2010, 03:13:36 pm »
What I do know is that Iran is the only country in the Middle East where outdoor sports are really popular with locals, rather than just expats.
Dont forget Lebanon and Israel.
Yes that flashed through my head when I typed the original sentence. I can only pronounce at all authoritatively on climbing:
- Lebanon, yes, locals climb and develop local cliffs
- Israel, yes, locals climb, but there is not much local rock thus staying active requires periodic invasions of Jordan and other neighbours (their national sport ...)

Of course, whether either of those Levant states really count as countries is a moot point. Both are very small ... like, say: Wales. And both are recent creations of bad 20th decision making by (mostly) France, US and the UK. Whilst Iran has been around for millennia.

Wales maybe small but its 100% sweet and a reall country.
rant rant independece from westminster rant systamatic dedevelopment rant moterway rant. rant. rant.
take your point about Israel and Lebanon though, and of course many would have you belive that the formers not middle eastern either ;)

I think I remember hearis some where that the Lebanese set up the worlds 3rd cave rescue organisation? could some one conferm or denay this?
disleksix of the world, untie!

Offline pete_the_caver

  • menacing presence
  • **
  • Posts: 206
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #17 on: April 03, 2010, 04:59:37 pm »
could pushing a political agenda gain you access and funding for a well publicised expedition?  :unsure:

Offline Mrs Trellis

  • British Jobs for British Shirkers
  • junky
  • ****
  • Posts: 830
  • Daft old bat
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #18 on: April 19, 2010, 11:19:12 am »
We've all forgotten "Paraued"  as a caving term. Thinking about it did bring a guilty smile though.
Mrs Trellis
Upper Sheeps Bottom
North Wales

Offline Huge

  • forum star
  • ****
  • Posts: 733
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #19 on: April 19, 2010, 02:32:05 pm »
Wales maybe small but its 100% sweet and a reall country.
rant rant independece from westminster rant

SWCC gained independance from Mendip in 1946.  ;D

Offline Peter Burgess

  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 9118
  • Left ukcaving by this name
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #20 on: April 19, 2010, 02:48:38 pm »
A couple of Welsh blokes on the Calais to Dover crossing were interviewed by an English reporter yesterday. It went something like this:

Interviewer: I expect you are really pleased to be home now and to see the White Cliffs.

Welsh bloke: Well, sort of, but when I see the Severn Bridge it will mean a lot more.

I have to say that I think the chalk cliffs of Sussex and Kent are a tad more impressive than either of the Severn crossings! And if we are comparing natural boundaries, should they not have been looking forward to seeing the extensive mud flats?  :tease:

And anyway, they should be grateful that the English built those bridges so they don't have to wade through all that mud any more!

Offline robjones

  • forum star
  • ****
  • Posts: 656
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #21 on: April 19, 2010, 09:08:18 pm »
The Severn Bridge is entirely in England: the England-Wales boundary is midway across the small bridge you cross over immediately before/after the Severn Bridge on the Welsh side. Not a lot of people know that  :smartass:

The Second Severn Crossing does span the England-Wales boundary.

To those of us of a certain generation, the Severn Bridge and Aust Services will always symbolise the boundary...

Who's to say that Aust Cliff can''t rival Dover cliffs? And mudflats can be WAY more interesting than lorry parks which is pretty much all you see at the foot of the Dover cliffs.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2010, 09:19:42 pm by robjones »

Offline graham

  • Retired
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 10943
  • UBSS, Speleo-Club de Perigueux, GSG, SUI
    • UBSS
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #22 on: April 19, 2010, 09:13:30 pm »
The Severn Bridge is entirely in Wales: the England-Wales boundary is midway across the small bridge you cross over immediately before/after the Severn Bridge on the Welsh side. Not a lot of people know that  :smartass:

Does not compute ... :unsure: :doubt: :-\ :shrug:
Caving is for Life not just for Christmas

Offline Les W

  • Hard cavin'
  • forum hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 5270
  • Wessex Cave Club, UCET
    • Wessex Cave Club
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #23 on: April 19, 2010, 09:15:25 pm »
The Severn Bridge is entirely in Wales:

I think you mean entirely in England.  :smartass:

the England-Wales boundary is midway across the small bridge you cross over immediately before/after the Severn Bridge on the Welsh side.  :smartass:

Over the river Wye.

The border runs up the middle of the Wye for a substantial part of its length, certainly in the lower parts.
I'm a very busy person

Offline robjones

  • forum star
  • ****
  • Posts: 656
Re: Ghar Parau, Iran
« Reply #24 on: April 19, 2010, 09:20:36 pm »
'Wales' corrected to 'England' in previous post  :-[ :-[ :-[