AR
Well-known member
I think so, there's mention in the photographic section here https://pdmhs.co.uk/pdmhs-library/
History of Matlock mines, caves - book progress update
- Thread starter History Trog
- Start date
pwhole
Well-known member
This was in the Glebe Cottage index, after a search for 'Harveydale':
p.1258. Vol.24.
Photo. "The Digger Hole".17th May 1978. Looking East from last photo, another trial Trench. All this ground
was totally changed later by Laportes. See supplememtary vols to Vol..26.
Photo. "Blake Mere". Rocharch's shaft near Blake Mere. This shaft was sunk into the Bonsall Fault.
The open-cut in the foreground was the later, Rcharch' Junr's exploratory open-cut.
p.1259. Vol.24.
Note:- Salter's Lane, which runs past the Digger Hole entrance runs down into Matlock, where we follow the
road South. Just through the Railway Bridge and on the right, lies Holt & Harveydale Quarry -
now occupied by "John Hadfield House", headquarters of Tarmac Roadstones Co. In the
quarry face, at the back of the house are the "Harveydale Tubes".
Photo. "Harveydale Tube .A.". 1954. Doug Nash emerging from the 'phreatic tube', after 4 hours 20 minutes
with little respite from this position. A.W.Ashwell on the ledge.
Photo. "Harveydale Tube .A." 1954. John Oakley emerging from the tube.
Photo. "Harveydale Tube .A." 1954. Alan Ashwell entering the tube, 1,500 ft long to a 150 ft drop to water
on "Seven Rakes Vein".
p.1260. Vol.24.
Photo. "Harveydale Tube .A." 1954. Margaret Oakley looking into the tube. The highlight of this tube is
"The Bedding Plane Desert" following a meandering trench in an open bedding barely a
foot high and lower on either side. 40 ft plus wide and 250 ft + in length. See Exp.20/131.
6th August 1954. OM Field Records Vol.1/2. G.1729.
There's also this on sketches/tracings, listed under 'Plan. E9':
E9. - 1. Print. Based on 1/2500 O.S. Shows:- Dennis Venture Vein. Moothall Vein. Dimple Rake.
Granby Foxholes. Carthegena Mine. Royal Oak Shaft on Moothall. Shining Dimple.
Crown Shaft. Seven Rakes Vein. Red Pipe. Seven Rakes Founder Shaft. Barcroft Vein.
Dimple Engine Shaft. Allenhill Spar Well (Chalybeate). Ladygate Vein.
E9. - 2. Tracing. Harveydale Tubes (Cave - Phreatic) running from Holt and Harveydale Quarry to
Seven Rakes.
E9. - 3. Print O.S. 25" Holt and Harveydale Quarry.
E9. -. 4. The fourway junction in Harveydale Tube Cave.
E9. - 5. Workings at Water Level on Seven Rakes as reached by the Harveydale Tube Cave.
Also found this listing in Op Mole field records, Vols 3-4:
Exp.19/236. "The Shaft defeated at the end of the Harveydale Tube." "Tearsall Sough",
Linchetts and Levels. "Seven Rakes Sough tail" Permission to move Westwards
towards Winster. 26th July-10th Aug. 1958.
Exp.20/237. "Seven Rakes Sough tail". OM/SM.113. 16th-17th Aug. 1958.
Exp.21/238. Shaft 510/4 - "The Cornishman" on White Hillocks Mine.
Harveydale Tube A. to Seven Rakes Mine - Workings in Toadstone. 23rd-24th Aug.1958.
Shafts 490/1 and 2. - "1861 Mine". OM/SM/114. Seven Rakes Mine.
Last edited:
History Trog
Member
pwhole - that all sounds very interesting. Cannot alter the text of the book now tho'. I looked through several year books of Op Mole records in the DRO - plenty about exploring Bullacetree Mine eg D5289/5. Doug published printed copies at least of the following The Summary For The Year 1957 which I have.
In about 1960, there are two "caves" recorded just outside Harveydale Quarry. 40 years after that, I visited the site of the one on the south side - just a low outcrop of limestone but there may have been a bedding plane entrance there once. Perhaps Op Mole explored that.
In about 1960, there are two "caves" recorded just outside Harveydale Quarry. 40 years after that, I visited the site of the one on the south side - just a low outcrop of limestone but there may have been a bedding plane entrance there once. Perhaps Op Mole explored that.
History Trog
Member
Thanks for your interest and apologies for the interminable delays. Have nearly finished the copyrights after which I hand over the illustrations to the editor, Richard Shaw, and then he has an awful lot of tedious work to do.
I had never had to deal with copyrights before and found it extraordinarily vexatious. The Derbyshire Record Office hit me with something called an Orphan Copyright - something that I refuse to do. Had to wait 3 months for the British Library to give permission for the use of a vital drawing of the wasteheaps on Hard Rake at Starkholmes, but at least they kindly waived their usual fees. Two auctioneers were very prompt and generous in allowing the use of their images but Bonhams have kept me waiting for 3 months or so for two vg pics - will have to plead with them to let us go ahead. Have to meet with Lynn Willies to finalise what to use.
Made a major discovery just looking at a photo of the Masson system workings - Lynn wanted me to rework the text to incorporate that but the editor would not like late additions so I just sorted it out in a lengthy caption for that pic. Andy Hayes has given me detailed scans of his old photos - I am most interested in pics that show things that are no longer accessible. The BCRA were rapid and generous in clearing the use of Eli Simpson's pics that were posted on the UK Caving website recently.
Be such a relief to get rid of the project - except that am expected to do something else next!
I had never had to deal with copyrights before and found it extraordinarily vexatious. The Derbyshire Record Office hit me with something called an Orphan Copyright - something that I refuse to do. Had to wait 3 months for the British Library to give permission for the use of a vital drawing of the wasteheaps on Hard Rake at Starkholmes, but at least they kindly waived their usual fees. Two auctioneers were very prompt and generous in allowing the use of their images but Bonhams have kept me waiting for 3 months or so for two vg pics - will have to plead with them to let us go ahead. Have to meet with Lynn Willies to finalise what to use.
Made a major discovery just looking at a photo of the Masson system workings - Lynn wanted me to rework the text to incorporate that but the editor would not like late additions so I just sorted it out in a lengthy caption for that pic. Andy Hayes has given me detailed scans of his old photos - I am most interested in pics that show things that are no longer accessible. The BCRA were rapid and generous in clearing the use of Eli Simpson's pics that were posted on the UK Caving website recently.
Be such a relief to get rid of the project - except that am expected to do something else next!
Iain Barker
Member
Looking forward to buying a copy of this!
History Trog
Member
In reply to Iain, there has been another hiccup.
Many years ago, I paginated the book with the idea of publishing it myself but decided it was way beyond my abilities. Its length was already excessive and I recommended going for grant funding to mitigate its cost. However, no one ever listens to me, and I was told to keep making it as definitive as I could despite the ever-increasing page length.
I knew trouble was brewing and joked with my old mate Andy Hayes, "Wait till they paginate it!".
A week ago I called on Lynn Willies who had kindly offered me his collection of local photos and he told me that the page length of the Matlock book was so excessive that copies printed for general sale would have to be priced at a loss to the society to stand any chance of selling and it was financially not viable.
This was no surprise to me but luckily in the meantime my late sister June had been very generous to me in her will, so I emailed Lynn offering a very substantial donation towards the publication costs, which I think should suffice. Hopefully, the editor, Richard Shaw, can cope with the massive task and do his normal marvellous job. Am still waiting to hear what is to happen.
The project has been round my neck like the Ancient Mariner's albatross for the last 50 years.
Many years ago, I paginated the book with the idea of publishing it myself but decided it was way beyond my abilities. Its length was already excessive and I recommended going for grant funding to mitigate its cost. However, no one ever listens to me, and I was told to keep making it as definitive as I could despite the ever-increasing page length.
I knew trouble was brewing and joked with my old mate Andy Hayes, "Wait till they paginate it!".
A week ago I called on Lynn Willies who had kindly offered me his collection of local photos and he told me that the page length of the Matlock book was so excessive that copies printed for general sale would have to be priced at a loss to the society to stand any chance of selling and it was financially not viable.
This was no surprise to me but luckily in the meantime my late sister June had been very generous to me in her will, so I emailed Lynn offering a very substantial donation towards the publication costs, which I think should suffice. Hopefully, the editor, Richard Shaw, can cope with the massive task and do his normal marvellous job. Am still waiting to hear what is to happen.
The project has been round my neck like the Ancient Mariner's albatross for the last 50 years.
History Trog
Member
Have to see what happens - it is not up to me to dictate how the Society goes about it.
Incidentally, has anyone got a few good unpublished photos of Wapping or Devonshire that I could use, with appropriate acknowledgement in the caption? Lynn was not able to supply any for those locations.
Incidentally, has anyone got a few good unpublished photos of Wapping or Devonshire that I could use, with appropriate acknowledgement in the caption? Lynn was not able to supply any for those locations.
mch
Member
Speaking as a member of PDMHS for 46 years, I find it disappointing that they are putting "financial viability" before the importance of publishing what would be the most well-researched book on lead mining in the Matlock area ever produced. Still, I suppose that in the post-Thatcher world accountants now run the show even in (some) voluntary societies - I should be used to it by now!
pwhole
Well-known member
Having looked through my snaps, I don't think my Wapping shots would be good enough, but I can send you a gallery link to make your own mind up. I do have good shots of Cumberland Cavern though, some of which have been published before, but only in a PDMHS photo supplement, as I remember. I've got some shots from Devonshire, but they're 15 years old, and again, may not pass muster for a book. Sadly I don't have the RAW files of those either, so not much chance of significant improvement - but I'll send you a link anyway. I'll put them together into galleries shortly.
mch
Member
Thank you for your encouraging comment, PDMHS Director. I will keep my fingers crossed!
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