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Insurance and over litigation, what can we do about it?

I

Imp

Guest
Hi,

Have received this text and thought it would be of wide appeal to you lot.

Imp


"The excerpt below is from Early Day Motion 1125 in support of the Promotion of Volunteering Bill. I have included it here because it provides the quickest and easiest way to deliver a brief description of the Bill. The National Caving Association has already written to Mr Brazier (MP) in support of this Bill and we now ask you to e-mail or write to your MP expressing your support.

“EDM 1125 Promotion of Volunteering Bill

That this House welcomes the Promotion of Volunteering Bill to protect volunteers from unreasonable litigation, particularly in the areas of sport and adventure training; welcomes the concept of statement of inherent risk as a means to reintroduce the idea of informed consent and to acknowledge that accidents can happen without contributory negligence; deplores the increasing cost of liability insurance which threatens the viability of many sporting clubs and societies…”

Despite receiving support from all corners of the House, Government has felt unable to support the Bill, which will have its third reading on Friday 16th July. It is unlikely to become law in its present state but, given enough support, it is hoped Government will take note that such legislation would be welcome and in time, will introduce its own version of the Bill.

As you can see, we do not have long to make ourselves heard so act promptly and by all means, distribute this message to anyone you feel may have an interest in the subject or be willing to add their support.

You can find a list of MPs with mailing, as well as e-mail addresses at http://www.parliament.uk/directories/hciolists/alms.cfm

If you wish to download the full text of the Bill, access http://www.parliament.the-stationery-office.co.uk/pa/cm200304/cmbills/018/2004018.htm

When writing to your MP, please keep your message short and poignant. A few lines expressing your support for the Bill and the consequences of excessive litigation will suffice. Alternatively, use the text below.

“Dear (MP)

I write to express my support for the Promotion of Volunteering Bill, introduced by Mr Julian Brazier MP.

As cavers, we have all benefited from the knowledge and experience handed over voluntarily by those that have been before us. It is a reflection of our increasingly litigious society that we are now having to insure against a claim for damages, suffered as the consequence of a bona fide accident whilst practising a sport which carries inherent risks. Combined with the spiralling cost of insurance, this is imposing limitations to our activities and causing many of us to think long and hard before taking new enthusiasts caving and this, can only be detrimental to our sport.

I for one would welcome a common sense Bill that reduces the risk of unreasonable litigation and recognises that accidents do happen.

Yours sincerely

(Signature) “

Regards

Eddy Hill
Secretary
NCA/BCA
"
 
C

cave shrimp

Guest
:oops: dont understand a lot o the big words :? but i wrote to me mp :D
 
I

Imp

Guest
:D Excellent! Every letter counts.
I think what it means is that there should be a very much reduced risk of getting done for damages should you, for example, be leading someone on a walk through our idyllic countryside and they trip on a boulder that you failed to move out of their path... tut tut
 

mudmonkey

New member
Just had a look at the bill. Great idea in principle. However it's very doubtful if caving clubs or people going out informally teaching their mates would be covered? But the military would be!?! :roll:

Ah well, it's a start and establishes a principle I guess...
 
I

Imp

Guest
Yep, I think that's the main idea of writing to MP's, to let them know that even if this bill is doomed to failure, in the long run we would welcome legislation resulting in reduced chances of litigation :deal: and a decrease in insurance premiums... woe my poor wallet!! :(
 
I

Imp

Guest
Hiyup!

I see there's been loads of viewings but... I'm curious to know how many of you have bothered to write to your MP :?:
 

SamT

Moderator
this is all a bit embarassing and really shouldnt admit it in public. :oops:

I have absolutly no idea who my mp is or how to write to them :oops: :oops:

Being one of the arse end of thatchers youth, the whole politics thing seemed to pass me by. Much more important things to be doing like climbing/caving/drinking/raving and generally enjoying myself rather than watching panorama and 'business lunch'.

However as I get older, I realise these things are quite important and do affect our daily lives. So at least I vote now. Which is an improvment.
I probably vote in ignorance, I wonder what percentage of the voting population dont.

Anyhows - I voted - but I've no idea who won, let alone how I write to them/E-mail them.

Bad isnt it. I feel ashamed.

So - I shall find out and submit my email. (On that note - I shy away from chain mails and circulars of the 'Bring down the price of petrol by not buying petrol' ilk. But I have actually read the proposed bill via the links provided and it all seems quite cosher.)
 
A

Ann

Guest
:roll: I sent a message to my MP on behalf of our caving club and also copied the post to all members on E Mail in case I could get anyone else interested in replying individually :)
 
T

tubby two

Guest
I sent a message to my mp on behalf of our uni caving and climbing clubs, and have also tried to encourage all the members to do likewise.

Way i see it it took me aboput 5 mins to do both, and in the long run it cant hurt.

tt. :up:
 

complex

Member
SamT said:
this is all a bit embarassing and really shouldnt admit it in public. :oops:

I have absolutly no idea who my mp is or how to write to them :oops: :oops:

3 How to write to your MP in 3 easy steps.
1) Go to www.faxyourmp.com
2) Enter your postcode into the box, click "GO" and let the website work out who your MP is
3) Fill in your address details, paste a suitable letter into the box at the bottom of the page, press "Preview" followed by "Submit" and its done

Takes 5 minutes.

Cheers,
Complex.
 

ian mckenzie

New member
Limiting the liability of the insurance company's customers will only result in windfall profits to them. A similar thing is happening in Canada with auto insurance - premiums are so high, that no-one wants to make a claim anymore (preferring to pay out-of-pocket for damages) - so the insurance company payouts have dropped, but the rates are not coming down and profits become obscene. The industry already knows that its customers are willing/able to pay these high premiums.

A similar thing happened with fuel tax some years ago. Government removed a tax, but industry refused to lower the overall price to consumers, because it was set by demand, not by costs - so they just pocketed the difference.

Liability-limiting legislation and other bits like it are important first steps in controlling the insurance monster, but government may have to drop the other shoe and legislate profit caps on this so-called 'private sector' industry. The way I see it, if the government or the courts make having insurance mandatory (e.g. auto insurance) then free-market forces don't strictly apply and gov't has a right to intervene.
 

bubba

Administrator
ian mckenzie said:
The way I see it, if the government or the courts make having insurance mandatory (e.g. auto insurance) then free-market forces don't strictly apply and gov't has a right to intervene.

Damn right.
 

cap n chris

Well-known member
Don't just cut and paste your letter to your MP; the site warns against doing this as it dilutes the message!

Use your own words - you don't need to write a great long debate just explain (without using f***ing expletives!) that you're concerned about any negative impact on outdoor pursuits generally (and caving more specifically) if society ends up having an instant knee-jerk reaction mindset of "sue them till they're bled white".

The FaxYourMP site is a superb idea and a brilliant service.
 
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