• Ghar Parau dinner invitation

    Have you or your club benefitted from Ghar Parau funding for an expedition?

    To mark the occasion of the 50th anniversary of its creation, a meal is to be held at the Anchor Inn in Tideswell, Derbyshire on Saturday 11th February, 2023. As well as a meal there will be speakers on behalf of the original Ghar Parau explorers and the current GPF committee.

    Details here

Rust oysters

tomferry

Active member
Just shows how complicated these things are !

The atmospheric conditions I have seen them growing /flourishing you can see a strong mist in the air assuming water droplets but am unsure.  :confused:

We need some one clever with lots of time on their hands to create them in their laboratory at home !
 

halkyn

New member
I first noticed these in Moel Fferna many years ago, and around 10 years ago I made numerous enquiries as to their nature.
There seemed back then to be almost no information around, but after reading a book on nano-bacteria, it seems to me to be the most likely cause. Clearly there's something organic going on because of the nature of the bi-valve shells. 
Has any research been done on these in more recent years?
 
Also been fascinated with these for a long time. What I find remarkable is you can find examples that have two perfectly mirrored clam-shells with nothing in-between. I have also found one partially open before now. Trying to find the photos but struggling to in my vast collection!

I once spoke to Simon and Bryony and I think she had known someone who studied them as part of a thesis for a PHD but never followed it up. Maybe if they are active here they can elaborate?
 

Pitlamp

Well-known member
I have seen them on metal underwater as well (y)

Indeed; it may be related to why the steel scaffolding holding open the entrance to Malham Cove Rising is in dire need of replacement (see attached picture). We're asking folk to avoid going there for the time being but we're currently negotiating with various authorities to secure permission for our plan for a new structure and lid, so that future generations of cave divers can enjoy it in safety. If all goes well this work will be completed by late spring or early summer. Incidentally if anyone's interested in time scales of deterioration, these particular scaff tubes went in during 1989. So this represents about 34 years of deterioration. The new structure will not be using ordinary scaff tubes, so it should last much better.

Malham_ent_scaff(4)171113.jpg
 

tomferry

Active member
Indeed; it may be related to why the steel scaffolding holding open the entrance to Malham Cove Rising is in dire need of replacement (see attached picture). We're asking folk to avoid going there for the time being but we're currently negotiating with various authorities to secure permission for our plan for a new structure and lid, so that future generations of cave divers can enjoy it in safety. If all goes well this work will be completed by late spring or early summer. Incidentally if anyone's interested in time scales of deterioration, these particular scaff tubes went in during 1989. So this represents about 34 years of deterioration. The new structure will not be using ordinary scaff tubes, so it should last much better.

View attachment 15017
Thanks for sharing the time frame is interesting
 

tomferry

Active member
I have seen pipes over 10m long with Chris covered in these underside and top side .

Right I am going to make my conclusion .

If we imagine a fungi attached to the pipe with roots, water is dripping on it filled with minerals and bacteria we have the correct conditions, the fungi eats the bacteria and starts releasing a waste product, which holds iron and other minerals this is deposited as a shell like structure over a long period of time, some times in one half some times in two, once this shell is complete a new structure starts to grow again from the attachment end and re covers the original she’ll eventually and so on.

If others believe I am wrong please do say your opinions about the statement ! Is not straight forward to understand, we have lost many pages on debates on this subject which was hosted on the aditnow forum and many other ideas people had about these fungi thingys.
 

ChrisJC

Well-known member
The question about how it grows is certainly an interesting one. I think it starts and grows from the same point, extruding the shell as it goes. That is why you never see half-built ones. The more it grows, the bigger the shell.

Chris.
 

Cantclimbtom

Active member
Wow Tom, forget rust oyster, you seem to have a pic of a rust brain coral.
Oddly before this thread was bumped, I was thinking of taking some rust oyster pics some time. Was thinking Moel Fferna would make a good hunting ground. Your pics are amazing, where did you take them Moel Ff? or elsewhere

Edit: Oops, just read the Parc comment above. Parc is already on my must return to list, so I will keep eyes peeled, I assume L3?
 

ChrisJC

Well-known member
Level 2. Generally you find them where it is very damp, so a lot of water falling and creating moisture in the air. Or drips on the metal.

Chris.
 

tomferry

Active member
Wow Tom, forget rust oyster, you seem to have a pic of a rust brain coral.
Oddly before this thread was bumped, I was thinking of taking some rust oyster pics some time. Was thinking Moel Fferna would make a good hunting ground. Your pics are amazing, where did you take them Moel Ff? or elsewhere

Edit: Oops, just read the Parc comment above. Parc is already on my must return to list, so I will keep eyes peeled, I assume L3?
Mind the holes ! :ROFLMAO:(y) If you ever want any information drop me a message I can give you recent updates;)
 
I have seen pipes over 10m long with Chris covered in these underside and top side .

Right I am going to make my conclusion .

If we imagine a fungi attached to the pipe with roots, water is dripping on it filled with minerals and bacteria we have the correct conditions, the fungi eats the bacteria and starts releasing a waste product, which holds iron and other minerals this is deposited as a shell like structure over a long period of time, some times in one half some times in two, once this shell is complete a new structure starts to grow again from the attachment end and re covers the original she’ll eventually and so on.

If others believe I am wrong please do say your opinions about the statement ! Is not straight forward to understand, we have lost many pages on debates on this subject which was hosted on the aditnow forum and many other ideas people had about these fungi thingys.
I suspect this is very much what happens. Now, what is that bacteria and why don't we still see them being formed?
Some essential resource is clearly running out sometime after they are formed. Is it from the hands of miners, or is there some other source, bats roosting, for instance and perhaps you just need the perfect combination of events to trigger the process.

They also seem to be present regardless of the age of the mine, but some areas you'd think they'd be present are void of any sign of the growths.
 

royfellows

Well-known member
Paul Marvin is correct re the photos.
I remember seeing some good rust oysters in the top level of Catherine and Jane gained by descending the stopes at the top of the site. This was many years ago.
 

cavemanmike

Active member
Somewhere in North Wales
 

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