Vally ent rope has been removed

[Fulk]

Cave Mapper:

I've never tried the alternative of prussiking up a rope thrown over the bridge, but I expect it would be tricky to get off the rope safely at the top.

You're right, it is a bit tricky; but if you used a rope thrown over the bridge as a top-rope, would it not be out of line with the climb? And hence tend to pull the climber off?

 

[Alex]

it then has an awkward step to the right near the top - and you would hurt yourself badly if you fell off from there.

It was at that point I aborted the climb and got on the rope, I have not changed my mind though and still think people can get stuck down there  if they are not that competent/good climbers, even with the chucking the rope over the rock. Please note I was not asking for the rope itself to be replaced as I believe it could be dangerous if not looked after for while I was only asking for notices to be put up (Small laminated cards at the first bolts and am not talking 6 by 6 feet wooden signs).

P.s. All this talk of education are these signs not a form of education? I.e. educating people that they need to rig the pitch, how else do you suggest we educate everyone?

 

[dunc]

Education; well, I think we should have laminated rigging topos at the first bolt of every pitch, along with diagrams of the knots you need to use to descend the pitch safely. I reckon it could be the future.....

 

[Fulk]

Education; well, I think we should have laminated rigging topos at the first bolt of every pitch, along with diagrams of the knots you need to use to descend the pitch safely.

Not to mention 5 pages of discussion about the strengths / weaknesses of said knots, how best to tie and 'dress' them . . . 

 

[langcliffe]

P.s. All this talk of education are these signs not a form of education? I.e. educating people that they need to rig the pitch, how else do you suggest we educate everyone?

It probably is, these days. In the good old days, education meant giving people the skills to work things out for themselves.

 

[Alex]

Just notice your new name thingy Lancliffe, can I clarify I said it was the view you were taking that I said was heartless not you.

 

[langcliffe]

Just notice your new name thingy Lancliffe, can I clarify I said it was the view you were taking that I said was heartless not you.

It was my genuinely held view and hence symptomatic of me, Alex.

 

[Gollum]

Education; well, I think we should have laminated rigging topos at the first bolt of every pitch, along with diagrams of the knots you need to use to descend the pitch safely. I reckon it could be the future.....

Fully agree. Have you seen the rigging from some cavers  :

 

[Cave Mapper]

... but if you used a rope thrown over the bridge as a top-rope, would it not be out of line with the climb? And hence tend to pull the climber off?

So long as the rope is running over the left end of the bridge, it's OK, and it does protect the crucial move.

But you do need an attentive belayer, because the last move onto the shelf is above the level of the bridge, so a pull from the belayer could take you over the bridge and down the other side - ouch.

 

[Pony]

Thanks for letting us know about the rope removal. Much appreciated. Shame the p. eople responsible were unable to do it themselves

 

[Glenn]

Thanks for letting us know about the rope removal. Much appreciated. Shame the p. eople responsible were unable to do it themselves

The rope was removed because it was dangerous. Why would you want to trust your life to a manky rope of unknown history?

The people responsible were more than capable of doing it (replacing it) themselves, and furthermore, doing it properly. But the consensus on this forum was that it should not be replaced.

http://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=14150.0

 

[Stu]

Glenn re: http://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=14150.0

Today we tested the anchors installed (in March 1998) in a long term test bed near Yordas middle entrance. The thinking was to see how freeze/thaw conditions over many years affected the resin bond. A report will be on the CNCC website in the next couple of weeks.

Had a quick nosy at CNCC site but couldn't see anything that post dated the October date of the thread. I suspect I'm missing something obvious!?

Stuart

 

[Glenn]

Hi Stu, you are not missing anything, we've just not had the time to complete the write up yet, too much to do....

 

[Stu]

Sure there is; no worries.

 

[Alex]

I agreed with removing the rope as it was dangerous, but asked for a notice up as it was gone but ended up with a big debate.

 

[langcliffe]

I agreed with removing the rope as it was dangerous, but asked for a notice up as it was gone but ended up with a big debate.

A number of notices, actually. The debate was the result of the fact that not everyone agreed with what you were asking for.  You condemned two of those that didn't like your idea as "selfish and heartless" for not doing so.

 

[Alex]

Well that was the way it looked like to me at the time, if you read the post entirely you can see my reasoning.

 

[langcliffe]

Well that was the way it looked like to me at the time, if you read the post entirely you can see my reasoning.

I simply said I wouldn't like to see notices.

You responded by telling me that I  "would see someone potentially die for a mistake they made just because you could not stand see a small notice spoiling your view of a bit of a dull wall in the cave".

Having put those words in my mouth, you responded to them by calling me "callous and selfish" for having such an attitude.

 

[Alex]

I was drawing attention to how contrast it was. On the one hand there is a bit of plastic attached to a few bolts on the other hand there is a potential human life at risk. (regardless how stupid they are). I did not put words into your mouth I was explaining what that opinion you had made actually meant.

With the contrast realised I concluded it to be a selfish etc view, I was not saying you were selfish so hence why I drew attention to how selfish the view was as I know thats not what you are like and I hoped you realised what you were implying.

Had I mis-interpreted that somehow?

 

[Pony]

The rope was removed because it was dangerous. Why would you want to trust your life to a manky rope of unknown history?

The people responsible were more than capable of doing it (replacing it) themselves, and furthermore, doing it properly. But the consensus on this forum was that it should not be replaced.

Thank God for that! At least it was nt a perfectly sound one. Now if I had decided to replace said rope I'd firstly put word out that it was in a poor condition to warn other folk of the danger and it be a case of on your head be it untill it was replaced. If it was such a danger to life and limb and needed to be removed immediately I d do that and then get word out straight away. Doesnt take 5 minutes to pop into Ingleton and get the jungle drums fired up, and this has taken me a couple of minutes to post. Hardly an inconvenience, as opposed to a party getting stuck and an avertable callout taking place. Now that is an inconvenience. But it has nt. Just a lack of old fashioned common and communication.
Was there a forum consensus that it should of been removed?
Alex and Langcliffe you play nice now