CT Footloop - Snap

[sneezinweasel]

Hello all,

I wanted to drop a little post about my CT footloop. I was on a trip yesterday on Fountains Fell. I'd just changed over on a rebelay and began prussiking, then bang. I dropped. I hadn't fallen but had a distinct feeling that I had. After a few split moments pondering mortality, I'd found that my loop had snapped.

Fortunately, the rest of the pitch was rift and at max 10m so I managed to thrutch up and was able to fashion a new loop for the exit.

This isn't a post berating or anything of that natures (etc). Ultimately, the loop states not to be used for PPE and everyone who participates in adventure should be aware of risk and hazard. However, I did want to ask whether anyone has experienced a similar equipment failure?
Things to note:

-The loop is probably 4 years old. I haven't stored it next to chemicals or in a damp place. I regularly dry/wash my kit after trips (in a fashion...).
- I didn't have my own sling to fashion a new loop. This would've been a little difficult had I been on a big pitch or with a group who didn't carry spare slings etc (a learning point for me!).
- I'm not a particular hard caver. I don't have log (another learning point) so can't say how many times the loop has been used but I'd be inclined to say sub 100 times.

Cheers,

The Sneezin' Weasel

 

[Ian Ball]

Brown trouser

 

[wellyjen]

Had footloops failures in use too. Scary moments. Anything special about the place it broke? A buckle, or rubbing against something. I had two Petzl dyneema footloops break the tape at the metal adjustment buckle. I've since changed to one tied from dyneema cord that has lasted several years with no sign of wear. If it is personal kit, there is no need to adjust it once set up, so buckles are not required.

 

[Wardy]

From my perspective as an equipment manufacturer there are different ways to look at products.

Make an item that is suitable in terms of strength and function.
If required test it and if it passes you can then sell it, as it meets the minimum requirements.

This does not make it a good product as while on day one it will work it may not do so for long.
It may also not be something you wish to own as it is unlikely to be very refined.
A lot of producers though see that doing this as cheaply as possible is really good as they can make the price more attractive.

The other approach is to make something that is more "fit for its intended purpose".
It will need to cover all the basics as above, but go on to include additional factors that are important and reflect the real needs of the user.

In the case of your footloop, when new it was fine - nice, light and well priced.
It possibly lacked durability and much additional strength - If it broke prussicking under 1 person load, then how would it have fared if you needed to use it for a simple counterbalance rescue that places more load on it?

With everyday items, buying a compliance level item has very few consequences apart from having to buy a new one.
In the case of an item of caving equipment the consequences of it failing are much bigger - not just for you, but everyone in your team.

My suggestion in the case of a footloop would be to make one from semi static rope - either buy a short piece or trim a rope and tie it to suit you.
Cheap, durable, can be made to fit, easy to use in counterbalance rescues, simple to replace, easy to inspect etc. - Fit for purpose.

I find the idea of adjustable tape footloops slightly amusing as my legs don't change length that much, so I only adjust it once, they also wear quick and are not that good for rescue, but they are cheap to make and some manufacturers like to sell them.

Look at Wellyjen's post, she's got it.
Always look at things you buy and think how you will use them rather than just trusting that the manufacturer understands you.
Good products are really great to own and use, but minimum compliance products are just cheap whatever the price.

 

[langcliffe]

Had footloops failures in use too. Scary moments. Anything special about the place it broke? A buckle, or rubbing against something. I had two Petzl dyneema footloops break the tape at the metal adjustment buckle. I've since changed to one tied from dyneema cord that has lasted several years with no sign of wear. If it is personal kit, there is no need to adjust it once set up, so buckles are not required.

Some stitching failed on a colleague's footloop (I'm not sure what species of footloop) whilst he was struggling out of the top pitch of Five Ways last week. As he always carries a spare sling on his harness, it wasn't a major incident. The problem was later solved by using a knot instead of stitching.

 

[aricooperdavis]

I use a hand tied dyneema footloop after a similar failure a few meters off the floor doing the big pitch of GG and having to finish the nearly 100m ascent using a too short sling. I also now carry a length of dyneema cord for "stuff" on my SRT trips.

 

[Flotsam]

I've a had footloop break at the end of a very long French trip (Fromagere), it was on the old style ropewalker I used at the time, it dropped down the rope. I put it down to wear from my boots at the time. Since then I thought it could have been sabotage as some of my gear disappeared from my gear bag stashed at the entrance. I've realised some years later I had an enemy on the expedition, someone who had it in for me. It's not paranoia, the gear disappearing, I'm certain it was down to this individual, my footlop breaking, I can't be sure.

 

[Wardy]

Flotsam, that is a story to tell.
Also not a place you want gear failure.

 

[PeteHall]

I use a hand tied dyneema footloop after a similar failure a few meters off the floor doing the big pitch of GG and having to finish the nearly 100m ascent using a too short sling. I also now carry a length of dyneema cord for "stuff" on my SRT trips.

Another alternative is just to pull up the end of the rope and cut off a couple of metres to make a new footloop the right length.

Obviously, this isn't always possible, for example, if you are between rebelays; the rope is only just long enough and is still needed in situ (either for others in your group, or because it's fixed rigging); it's not your rope and you're more likely to be killed by the owner than the cave. However, it's worth keeping in mind, as it could get you out of a sticky situation, so long as you have a knife.

Personally, I favour bit of static rope, threaded through a short length of hosepipe where you tread in it, which protects the worst abrasion point. It also keeps the footloop open, so it's much easier to kick your foot back in if you take it out passing awkward sections of a pitch.

 

[Fulk]

According to the document Industrial rope access - Investigation into items of personal protective equipment:

'Knotted tape cow’s tails cannot be recommended for use where any dynamic loading is possible.'

From which I would infer that tape is not suitable as a safety attachment for one's footloop. For this reason, I use statice rope for the actual footloop and dynamic rope for the safety cord.

 

[mikem]

It will only have snapped at that point due to either wear or being dried in the sun (tape is much more quickly affected by UV than rope).

 

[Badlad]

I've had this happen a number of times. It is quite disconcerting when it breaks as you are usually stepping up with some force. Bang it goes. Mine tend to break on the adjustable buckle wear point. However, I always use two footloops and can easily get out with just the one. Never had two go at the same time as they are usually different ages. I'm quite happy to put up with this very occasional inconvenience (shock) as I do like the thin tape footloops. They sit very neatly when clipped into the harness gear loop, are lightweight and I can use one or two feet prussiking when I want. I should also say that I have changed them before they have actually broken too.

If you do lose your footloop, by breaking, dropping etc., there are some emergency measures that will get you to the top of the pitch. Use the rope below you in a loop and clasp it tight with your hands for example.

 

[Flotsam]

When it happened to me I was utterly knackered, I hadn't slept or eaten for a couple of days, the shock was tremendous. I literally saw stars, vivid hallucinations. Fortunately it was the entrance pitch, the last pitch out and I was using a three jammer setup so was able to continue on one leg.

 

[IanWalker]

@sneezinweasel - do you dry your kit in the sun?

another potential use for carrying a short bit of thin rope / fat cord.

i would rather a stuck caver cuts the pitch rope than stays stuck on a rope. assuming the stuck caver has their own knife

 

[PeteHall]

i would rather a stuck caver cuts the pitch rope than stays stuck on a rope.

Agreed, so long as it doesn't trap another caver below the pitch. In which case, I suppose it depends how stuck the stuck caver is...

 

[IanWalker]

Stuck is stuck. If they don't get off they will possibly die on the rope before rescue arrives. I would rather they cut the rope. Even if its my rope, and even if I'm then trapped below.

Ropes can be rerigged and trapped parties can be untrapped.

 

[Maisie Syntax]

I would rather they cut the rope. Even if its my rope, and even if I'm then trapped below.

No need to get trapped.
Person with broken footloop abs back down; everyone below with a functioning footloop goes up; person with bust footloop improvises something with whatever rope is at the bottom, then ascends last and buys beers.
Or, If anyone above has suitable sling (or something suitable to improvise, it can be sent back down the rope to fashion a suitable footloop.

 

[IanWalker]

Naturally, if they can stand up to make the changeover from chest jammer to descender without a footloop to stand in, then great.

I would still rather my team mates are aware that ropes can be cut and that is preferable to being stuck on a rope. Once off the rope, other issues can be sorted.

One of the first things people do when they buy a rope is cut it into lengths. Its not a big problem.

 

[Maisie Syntax]

Naturally, if they can stand up to make the changeover from chest jammer to descender without a footloop to stand in, then great.

Fairly simple to loop the rope below you around your foot a few times, then it will be enough to step up and remove your chest jammer.

 

[IanWalker]

Fairly simple to loop the rope below you around your foot a few times, then it will be enough to step up and remove your chest jammer.

Badlad highlighted a similar technique above. I am aware of it and have done this in the past with success.

There are other ways of solving this problem, no doubt we could think up many given enough time at the keyboard. The use of any of which would mean the caver is not stuck on a rope.

But my point its, being stuck on a rope with no footloops is a potentially life-threatening situation. Sometimes people don't have the particular equipment on them, knowledge of techniques or the presence of mind to recall them, or the strength to use them. And in those cases the rope is available to be cut if needed.