Author Topic: Rigging Spanners  (Read 9134 times)

Offline potholer

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #25 on: February 28, 2012, 11:29:38 am »
Flexible ratchet spanners with a hinge at the ring end can be good if a bolt isn't on a flat wall.

Offline Anon

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2012, 02:17:15 pm »
I think what Rob and potholer describe is similar to what I have at present:


Elastic cord to go over arm if needs be, or maillon to clip into (had this lying around spare for years until I finally found a use for it!) then bog standard accessory cord to the middle of flexi-ratchet spanner, tied and then taped with electrical tape. Might not be the best method or tidiest setup but it does the job. (Thinking about it, could probably do with longer cord and a knot in the middle with a loop to clip into)

Offline Roger W

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2012, 07:23:34 pm »
Maybe this guy has a technique worth investigating....





"That, of course, is the dangerous part about caves:  you don't know how far they go back, sometimes... or what is waiting for you inside."   JRR Tolkein: "The Hobbit"

Offline cavermark

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2012, 07:37:39 pm »
I find bungy good to limit tangles and allows either hand to be used from arm attachment loop.

A hole can be drilled in the shaft of the spanner for attachment loop, to allow ring end to be open.

Been promising myself a ratchet spanner - 13mm is the size to tighten a Merc vito van handbrake cable too!

Offline jarvist

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #29 on: February 29, 2012, 02:40:55 am »
I have a fairly tight wrist loop of bungee, onto which my spanner is tied by a 45cm length of 2mm accessory cord. I can use the closed end on bolts just fine, the bit of cord actually helps keep it in place. It mostly lives in my Meander pocket with the cord looped from head-to-tail (the knot through the ring end gives just enough purchase to loop over). When I'm not immediate using it, I loop the cord around my wrist, then poke the spanner through a twist in the bungee, takes two seconds and is more than secure enough for drilling the next bolt / prussicing to the next rebelay.

     

Offline Pitlamp

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Re: Re: Underground mishaps and other incidents...
« Reply #30 on: February 29, 2012, 10:40:03 am »
13mm ring spanner works on ring hangers as well, and because it has many "faces" it is easier to get on than an open ended spanner in restricted places where you cannot get at least a 1/6th turn.

Yes, of course you're right Les.

Offline Cap'n Chris

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #31 on: February 29, 2012, 10:53:53 am »
Here's my dual ended M8 & M10 spanner; a gift from a Spanish caving friend.  :)


Offline Joel Corrigan

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #32 on: February 29, 2012, 11:58:16 am »
Can't wait for the next exciting thread on here: could it be "Caving Underpants" by any chance??

Er, for what it's worth fancy torque wrenches are all very well but I don't think people should forget the need for an open-ended spanner to deal with maillons.  And surely the only reason to have string on your spanner is so that you can turn it into a sketchy prussick loop or to cut through your abseil rope when you least expect it?!  It's gotta be bungee every time for me as in the real world the hanger isn't going to be directly in front of your face & cord isn't known for it's elastic qualities....

Offline Duncan

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #33 on: February 29, 2012, 02:42:32 pm »
My preferred setup is a shortened ring spanner on a very short bungy cord with a loop round my right wrist - the cord is just long enough that the spanner can hang down into a potition where it can be gripped by my right hand. When not in use the spanner sits inside the elasticated cuff of my sleeve. If I can't reach the bolt with my right hand, I simply slip the spanner onto my left wrist, but I seldom seem to need to do this.

This setup is extremely compact and lightweight, and has essentially no tendency to catch on things, fall off, or get tangled up.

Duncan.

Offline jarvist

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #34 on: March 05, 2012, 09:56:39 pm »
It's gotta be bungee every time for me as in the real world the hanger isn't going to be directly in front of your face & cord isn't known for it's elastic qualities....

However, I can guarantee that any hanger you'll ever tighten will be within 20cm of a wrist as you do it...  ::)
Seriously though, I got a lot more happy with my spanner set up once I stopped having it on my upper arm, and lost 50% of the bulk of the material.

Offline hrock

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #35 on: March 27, 2012, 04:22:34 am »
i have a flexi head short ratcheting ring spanner open at the other end. a bit like dunc's picture but i think that is way too long and the ones with out flexi heads like rob's one are very anoying as nearly always the rock gets in the way or you gloves catch the swich and turn it to back wards.

then i tie a short bit of string round the middle with a barrle knot and put a small loop in the other end only about 1 inch away so i can clip it to a crab on my gear loop.

when you use it if you dont let go of it you dont drop it. not having meters of string means that your dont get tagled up you can use it in both hands at full strech. just dont lend it to any one elce as they will drop it (but if i am bolting then i do but a spare cheapo spanner in the darren drum with a spare drill bit etc.

you can get things that are like a though bolt but insted of thred sticking out there is a hole that might save you even taking a spanner to move the bolders?



i can  only find them in 6mm hole witch i am guessing is a bit weedy but you might find bigger.
faulty since production (can't spell) (spell chequed by chris)

Offline hrock

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #36 on: March 27, 2012, 04:37:34 am »
or even

http://www.fastfixdirect.co.uk/code/navigation.asp?fType=Fasteners&MainCategoryID=9&ProductCategoryID=248&PageID=2

as thinking about it you will be hand drilling them under water i would guess and this should fit in a spit ok for the sake of pulling a bolder
faulty since production (can't spell) (spell chequed by chris)

Offline Alex

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #37 on: March 28, 2012, 06:45:22 pm »
I got one of them attatched to a bungi cord, I simply slip it between me and my harness when I am not using it. It don't get in the way.
Anything I say is represents my own opinion and not that of a any club/organisation that I am a member of (unless its good of course)

Offline Joel Corrigan

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #38 on: March 29, 2012, 10:29:04 am »
It's gotta be bungee every time for me as in the real world the hanger isn't going to be directly in front of your face & cord isn't known for it's elastic qualities....

However, I can guarantee that any hanger you'll ever tighten will be within 20cm of a wrist as you do it...  ::)

"Of a wrist": correct.  But which one?  With these short cords that people are talking about you wouldn't be able to reach the bolt that's off on the other side without transferring it to the other arm and that way madness lies.....  Caves don't always play the game by allowing you to place bolts in textbook locations so we have to be able to reach into daft positions to be able to drill & fix.  If you're just tightening the occasional bolt then anything will suffice but if you're dropping a big pitch series or climbing avens then I believe that a longer bungee still rules.  And I'm a very open-minded chap (!) but I'm not convinced that having the spanner glued to one hand is of much use in the real world unless you've got Go-Go-Gadget Telescopic Arms!!!

Offline jarvist

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #39 on: March 29, 2012, 10:52:11 am »
If you're just tightening the occasional bolt then anything will suffice but if you're dropping a big pitch series or climbing avens

Seemed fine to solo derig a 550m pitch series in the summer, removing 120-150 plates & maillons  as I went. Thinking back, I think it was OK at rigging the majority of said pitch series a few weeks previously.

I like the fact that if I choose to drop it (after removing the plate), it ends up at a sensible height, rather than wrapped around stuff below me. Transferring hands takes seconds, though I honestly didn't have to often do it. Sometimes I reach across with both hands + tighten with the other, I quite often do this anyway, putting a steadying hand against the rock near the plate as a undo it (or lifting the rope and maillon to take weight off it). Of course, if you're putting in a plate, you're holding the plate with the other hand until you get the screw thread started anyway.

Offline potholer

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #40 on: March 29, 2012, 12:23:36 pm »
But then you do have rather long arms...

Offline marysboy

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #41 on: March 29, 2012, 12:27:17 pm »
i often 'go leashless' these days and simply carry the spanner in a dangly bag.

but then i do like to live life on the edge...

Offline TheGrave

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #42 on: November 29, 2018, 02:59:34 am »
Here's my dual ended M8 & M10 spanner; a gift from a Spanish caving friend.  :)



I'd kill a friend for this, my friend  ;D

Any clue about make or model?

Offline TheGrave

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #43 on: November 29, 2018, 04:18:47 am »

I'd kill a friend for this, my friend  ;D

Any clue about make or model?

Scratch that and look at this!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B001NYX44G/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&psc=1

If only we could find an alternative that didn't cost a kidney for a piece of metal...

Offline topcat

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #44 on: November 29, 2018, 07:38:13 am »
I use a stubby ratchet ring with the other end open ,
attached via snoopy loop on my arm.

The ratchet is superb, very fast and easy to use. If course it is susceptible to mud and grit but so far no issues.  I put it away for muddy crawls etc and maintain it.  The open end is there as a back up in the event of mid cave failure of the ratchet.  Which would probably just seize and operate as a non ratchet ring spanner so no big issue.

The short length helps prevent over tightening which is a major spit killer.

Offline SamT

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #45 on: November 29, 2018, 07:53:08 am »
Is this post some sort of retro 80s post?

Offline andrewmc

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #46 on: November 29, 2018, 09:01:22 am »
Scratch that and look at this!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B001NYX44G/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&psc=1

If only we could find an alternative that didn't cost a kidney for a piece of metal...

Problem with ring spanners is you can't always get them onto the thing...

I have a spanners with a flexi head ratchet ring on one end (non-reversing, just turn it round!) and a normal open-ended spanner on the other - one in M8, one in M10.

Like this:
https://www.zoro.co.uk/shop/hand-tools/ratchet-combination/professional-flex-head-ratchet-combination-spanners-metric/f/5260

but I think mine are Halford Professional off eBay.

I don't think I've ever used the M10 one and probably wouldn't need it on exped (because everything is standardized on M8) so having M8 and M10 on the same spanner is probably not that useful. What _would_ be nice would be an open-ended ratchet spanner for those many hangers where the ring doesn't fit...

Offline topcat

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #47 on: November 29, 2018, 09:40:12 am »
Is this post some sort of retro 80s post?

No, but it is a clear indication that contrary to what some would have you believe, spits are still very much in use down our caves :)

Offline TheGrave

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #48 on: November 29, 2018, 11:45:26 am »
Scratch that and look at this!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B001NYX44G/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&psc=1

If only we could find an alternative that didn't cost a kidney for a piece of metal...

Problem with ring spanners is you can't always get them onto the thing...

I have a spanners with a flexi head ratchet ring on one end (non-reversing, just turn it round!) and a normal open-ended spanner on the other - one in M8, one in M10.

Like this:
https://www.zoro.co.uk/shop/hand-tools/ratchet-combination/professional-flex-head-ratchet-combination-spanners-metric/f/5260

but I think mine are Halford Professional off eBay.

I don't think I've ever used the M10 one and probably wouldn't need it on exped (because everything is standardized on M8) so having M8 and M10 on the same spanner is probably not that useful. What _would_ be nice would be an open-ended ratchet spanner for those many hangers where the ring doesn't fit...

What is the problem normally, rusty bolt head? Or perhaps "non-standard" nut size? Just spoke with a friend who purchases nuts and bolts frequently, said he got an M10 in 15mm:

https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/metric-bolt-head-wrench-size-d_1458.html?fbclid=IwAR3VVL8sUYLQlDtAJwvzuzkWj6Iok9pr0D7ACdqSiUqyO9f0I8sZ5U9jcAM

DIN should be the norm for Europe as per my understanding so 17mm key is what we should have in the pocket, right?

Btw not a big fan of this flexi-head, I'd rather use something like this:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Reversible-13mm-Ratchet-Spanner-Wrench-5-Ratcheting-15-Offset/142948096583?hash=item21485eda47:g:vhkAAOSwPQ9bphr3:rk:30:pf:0

Is this post some sort of retro 80s post?

No, but it is a clear indication that contrary to what some would have you believe, spits are still very much in use down our caves :)

Sorry for resurrecting an old topic but I think quite some people are facing these questions when purchasing wrenches so hopefully it will be useful for the future generations :)

Whether it's a nut or a bolt you still need a tool to fasten/unfasten it, right :) ? Spits on M10 are quite rare but anchor bolts on M10 are most def present in Bulgaria, mainly from rescue training events.

Offline AlexR

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Re: Rigging Spanners
« Reply #49 on: November 29, 2018, 01:16:39 pm »
I don't trust myself with those long spanners, more risk of stripping a thread, taking a concrete screw top off, etc.. A small spanner also fits better under my elbow pad  :) Annoyingly stubbies are more expensive than their long counterparts, no idea why.

Pretty standard setup, snoopy loop around my upper arm, elastic to keep it. The elastic is a little too long, been meaning to change it for ages but never got round to it.
Personally I'd really want an open ended side, I like to make maillons spanner tight when rigging something for a while both for safety and to make it less likely someone will pinch them.