Author Topic: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey  (Read 2002 times)

Offline GarDouth

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Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« on: January 29, 2020, 03:52:51 pm »


We'd like your thoughts on the Hidden Earth beaker that you receive at each event as part of your entry. In order to improve our environmental impact and volunteer work load we're interested in how you use your beaker.

Please take a moment to answer three quick questions. Thanks for your help.

Click here to respond to the survey...
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Online maxb727

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2020, 03:57:02 pm »
Great! Was literally chatting about this with some people this week. Reusable beakers are great but I’ve got so many now that I’d rather reuse the ones I have than collect more. After all they are still plastic even if they last longer than disposable beakers!


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Online Pegasus

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2020, 04:20:58 pm »
I agree with maxb727  :)

Offline estelle

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2020, 10:58:02 pm »
i recall someone saying that in order for these lovely plastic beakers to be more environmentally friendly than a disposable plastic glass, they have to be reused about 30 times. Between HE and festivals, we have over 20 of them now and while yes, they are a bit of a memento of the events and a fair few came as part of the entry fee, but we probably don't need any more and always have some in each of our vehicles, the camping kit, etc. to reuse and avoid plastic glass use where possible. Good to see Hidden Earth taking this onboard with the poll. :)
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Online pwhole

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2020, 11:49:52 pm »
Digging buckets for really precise digs?

Alternatively, drill a tiny hole in the bottom of two, thread some dyneema fishing line through them with a big stopper knot - instant underground communications system, with embedded HE promotion for glistening photoshoots. Indestructible and waterproof. Even works in shafts ;)

Offline Maj

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2020, 12:54:31 am »
I'll just leave this here.   
 
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Offline yrammy

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2020, 09:07:58 am »
Donate the money to cave rescue

Offline s_allshorn

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2020, 10:00:32 am »
Are there other sources of waste that could also be removed by people bringing there own stuff, coffee cups, plastic knives and forks, plates etc?

Is the waste reduced where possible, then reused and then finally recycled?

Offline GarDouth

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2020, 11:06:23 am »
Are there other sources of waste that could also be removed by people bringing there own stuff, coffee cups, plastic knives and forks, plates etc?

Is the waste reduced where possible, then reused and then finally recycled?

You're quite right Sam, there is a lot of this kind of stuff too. The slight issue is that the food side of things is not done by HE but by the catering staff in place at the venue. There has been some discussion about coffee cups too and how best to avoid single use ones. Tea/coffee is easier in the sense of no licence issues and of course people can bring their own thermal mug. I would like to make more effort to encourage people to do so this year.

On the whole HE doesn't really produce too much waste, the biggest impact by far is people driving to the venue so try and car share where possible. Things like the badge holders are re-used every year and with the TVs and online timetable we used way less paper last year.
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Offline Maj

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2020, 01:03:05 pm »
I would also like to add to GarDouth's reply.

We have for many years been reducing waste and recycling at Hidden Earth.
 
Hidden Earth 19 delegates I hope noticed that there were conventional (kerbside collection) type recycling boxes dotted about in the Trade Hall & outside the Bar area. We recycle what we can (given volunteer time restraints) and at the Wrexham we were fortunate since they had large wheelie bins for the recycling on site which we were allowed to use. But this is not usually the case so when at a venue  where recycling and waste bins are not available we take it all off site. This then becomes another unseen job to sort and take to a local recycling point on the Mon/Tues.
The task of dealing with the recycling and rubbish is done by the existing busy volunteers, but perhaps someone would like to take on this role and also look into ways of reducing HE's carbon footprint and environmental impact.

Maj.   
 
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Offline mikem

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2020, 03:08:34 pm »
Would be interesting to know how many pints are usually drunk - divided by the 600 cups would give you an approximation on their environmental impact (compared to disposable glasses).

Also difficult to know how many people would forget to bring them / not have been before, so need a new one. Perhaps a generic Hidden Earth version should be given out this year & the same design used in future (with a charge made for those needing new mugs)?

Have you done a comparison of attendees between different years to see how many are repeat "offenders" & how many go to just their local events, or only once?
« Last Edit: January 30, 2020, 03:19:06 pm by mikem »

Offline darren

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2020, 07:41:56 pm »
My club allows members to opt out of physical copies of it journal. An online version is available.

Could the option to opt out of the Beaker be offered on the booking form?

This would give a far better idea of what people want than online surveys. I am quite happy to help hand out Beakers on the day and remind people that they ticked the no Beaker option
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Offline GarDouth

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2020, 07:51:39 pm »
My club allows members to opt out of physical copies of it journal. An online version is available.

Could the option to opt out of the Beaker be offered on the booking form?

This would give a far better idea of what people want than online surveys. I am quite happy to help hand out Beakers on the day and remind people that they ticked the no Beaker option

A perfectly reasonable suggestion however the issue remains of weather to get a generic beaker in which case your idea works well, or getting a year specific one which may end up with loads left over and an even worse impact. A similar alternative would be to sell sell the beaker at the bar for say one or two pounds like you would do at most beer festivals thus having an 'opt in' system.
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Offline darren

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2020, 08:02:54 pm »
Selling generic Hidden earth Beakers at the bar is buy far the best option.

Bit pricey if you only want 1 pint on 1 day. I'm guessing you'd measure a pint into a water bottle if required👍
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Offline mikem

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2020, 12:42:22 am »
The problem is that the glasses normally have to be ordered before the majority of bookings are in.

TBF the cost would only take it up to the price of a pint in many public bars anyway...

Offline CatM

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2020, 01:59:21 am »
Selling generic Hidden earth Beakers at the bar is buy far the best option.

Bit pricey if you only want 1 pint on 1 day. I'm guessing you'd measure a pint into a water bottle if required
"only want 1 pint" - really?! We're taking about cavers here! ;)

There is always the option though to bring your own receptacle if you didn't want to buy a beaker just for one pint. Or if you don't have one then you just buy one (it's only a quid after all) and then you have one available to reuse in future.

I agree that a generic beaker - either for sale or for an optional (free) addition on entry - is the way to go. No wastage as any not used can be brought out again the following year.

You could possibly give the option of returning the beakers for reuse at the end of the weekend for those who didn't want to keep them to minimise wastage further (though I can foresee potential problems with that).

Good on the HE team for taking the initiative on this :)

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Offline darren

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2020, 07:49:31 am »
Selling generic Hidden earth Beakers at the bar is buy far the best option.

Bit pricey if you only want 1 pint on 1 day. I'm guessing you'd measure a pint into a water bottle if required
"only want 1 pint" - really?! We're taking about cavers here! ;)

There is always the option though to bring your own receptacle if you didn't want to buy a beaker just for one pint. Or if you don't have one then you just buy one (it's only a quid after all) and then you have one available to reuse in future.


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You may need to sit down, this might come as a shock. Not only do some cavers only have 1 pint, it is sometimes Coke if they are driving home. If you bring your kids with you for the day and fancy a drink buying 3 breakers for £3 might smart a bit.

I do like your idea of bringing your own receptacle though, maybe a sports water bottle would work? It is the only suitable container I own.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2020, 08:03:35 am by darren »
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Online Pegasus

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2020, 10:36:17 am »
I've just put two of our old Hidden Earth beakers in with our 'Take to Hidden Earth' for the stand stuff so I remember to take them.  Nearer the time we should have a publicity drive to remind people to bring beakers and water bottles etc.

I'm so pleased to see this issue discussed so positively  ;D

Offline Cavematt

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #18 on: January 31, 2020, 12:07:41 pm »
Are there not issues with Weights and Measures regarding bringing your own glass/beaker for beer? I assume the bar, from a licencing perspective needs to be sure it is serving an accurate pint, so having everyone bringing a different glass might be an issue here as there can be no certainty each is an accurate pint. I might be totally wrong though. I guess not so much of an issue for non-alcoholic drinks.
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Offline CatM

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #19 on: January 31, 2020, 12:21:16 pm »
Are there not issues with Weights and Measures regarding bringing your own glass/beaker for beer? I assume the bar, from a licencing perspective needs to be sure it is serving an accurate pint, so having everyone bringing a different glass might be an issue here as there can be no certainty each is an accurate pint. I might be totally wrong though. I guess not so much of an issue for non-alcoholic drinks.
Surely fine if it's still a pint glass? Just meant it doesn't need to specifically be a hidden earth one...

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Offline mikem

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2020, 12:44:05 pm »
Although they do need to be able to identify it as a pint:
https://www.businesscompanion.info/en/quick-guides/weights-and-measures/the-sale-of-alcohol-in-licensed-premises

Soft drinks (& certain others) it doesn't matter.

Offline darren

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2020, 12:51:28 pm »
Are there not issues with Weights and Measures regarding bringing your own glass/beaker for beer? I assume the bar, from a licencing perspective needs to be sure it is serving an accurate pint, so having everyone bringing a different glass might be an issue here as there can be no certainty each is an accurate pint. I might be totally wrong though. I guess not so much of an issue for non-alcoholic drinks.

I sort of took it for granted that the liquid would be measured using a standard measure before being decanted into customers container. I now realise this would cause chaos in the evening when serious drinking was underway but may work during quieter times.

Maybe a sticker could be applied to peoples pots after their volume has been checked.
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Offline darren

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2020, 12:55:01 pm »
Has anyone been in the Hunters and seen the wide range of personal receptacles they serve beer in? Some are distinctly homemade.
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Offline andrewmc

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2020, 02:22:39 pm »
Has anyone been in the Hunters and seen the wide range of personal receptacles they serve beer in? Some are distinctly homemade.

I suspect that any legislation passed after 1970 hasn't reached the Hunters yet, due to the strange distortions of space and time in the vicinity...

Offline andrewmc

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2020, 02:24:03 pm »
Although they do need to be able to identify it as a pint:
https://www.businesscompanion.info/en/quick-guides/weights-and-measures/the-sale-of-alcohol-in-licensed-premises

Soft drinks (& certain others) it doesn't matter.

Presumably if I bring an _old_ Hidden Earth beaker, then it is easily identifiable as a pint (not that I will be drinking alcohol anyway).

Offline complex

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #25 on: January 31, 2020, 02:36:56 pm »
If you bring your kids with you for the day and fancy a drink buying 3 breakers for £3 might smart a bit.
Why would it smart a bit?

Hidden Earth bar prices are extremely reasonable - I think it was £2.50 a pint last year, so even if you only buy one pint plus a beaker, you'll pay £3.50 (ie basically pub prices, and you'll have a souvenir beaker to take home). I don't know off the top of my head what they were charging for soft drinks, but my guess is that they were just as reasonable.

And don't forget that any profit from the HE bar goes back into caving good causes, instead of lining the pockets of the pub chain owner.

Offline darren

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Re: Hidden Earth Beaker Survey
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2020, 03:50:07 pm »
If you bring your kids with you for the day and fancy a drink buying 3 breakers for £3 might smart a bit.
Why would it smart a bit?

Hidden Earth bar prices are extremely reasonable - I think it was £2.50 a pint last year, so even if you only buy one pint plus a beaker, you'll pay £3.50 (ie basically pub prices, and you'll have a souvenir beaker to take home). I don't know off the top of my head what they were charging for soft drinks, but my guess is that they were just as reasonable.

And don't forget that any profit from the HE bar goes back into caving good causes, instead of lining the pockets of the pub chain owner.

I struggled long and hard over this reply.  Our relationships with money are obviously very different. I have in the not so distant past had to forgo the post caving drinks due to lack of money, that sort of thing stays with you. Its often not the total amount but the perceived value for money.  Lets leave it there.
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