UK Caving

WHERE THE CAVES ARE - The Caving Regions => Peak District => Topic started by: richardg on September 23, 2019, 08:10:16 pm

Title: PIKERS PIT
Post by: richardg on September 23, 2019, 08:10:16 pm

Does anyone know of the current access situation for Pikers Pit at the head of Dovedale, and is anyone actively working on the site, or have an interest in doing so?

Also I have a  memory of reading somewhere,a chemical analysis table of resurgences where it said that the major spring  further down Dovedale, the Crowdiwell had allogenic input, does anyone have information on this?
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: danthecavingman on September 23, 2019, 08:42:03 pm
Many years ago (Mid Nineties) we spoke to the farmer up there and permission to poke around on his land was refused. The reason given was that some of the land up there was used as a testing range for gas shells during WW1 and within his living memory he'd lost cattle due to them being poisoned by decaying ordnance. He gave us a graphic description of looking across the fields at dusk and occasionally being able to see a green haze / mist where gas was leaking from below the ground.
Also, the area was apparently bombed by a Zeppelin, not all of the shake holes are actually shake holes according to the farmer!
Something to bear in mind maybe, if permission is given up that end of the valley. Not sure how much truth there is in the stories but he spun a good yarn!

Dan.
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: richardg on September 23, 2019, 09:19:31 pm
Thank you ...but....

Flipping Eck Dan !!!

That is an amazing story to retell..
Certainly its a very peculiar dale, a lot of the apparent shakes have the remains of what had been buildings in them at some time in the past, what they had been originally I wouldn't know.

I guess from your retelling of the farmers description they could have been bomb sites....

I am, I admit Dan, a bit nervous now about a project in Pikers Pit, Although it would have been an excellent project with apparent great potential
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: danthecavingman on September 24, 2019, 06:56:32 am
Haven't had time for a proper read of this article but Greensides Farm is mentioned in it..... This could certainly back up the farmer's story. I think trench mortars could fire gas shells?

https://buxtoncivicassociation.org.uk/the-frith-artillery-range-harpur-hill/

Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: Fishes on September 24, 2019, 08:36:02 am
I wonder if some of this has been mixed with the destruction of mustard gas stocks from Harper Hill which I understand was burnt on the moor after WW2.
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: bograt on September 24, 2019, 09:11:46 am
Back in the early/mid 1970's the group I was with (VOPS) did some furkling in that area and found some very interesting leads. We reached a point where more serious ground removal was required so sought out the farmer, upon requesting permission to excavate further the reply was an unequivacable  "You b'aint not digging 'oles on moi land". I do recall some what looked like very rusty shells in one of the shakeholes ---     (I think YRAMY may have been with us?)
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: yrammy on September 24, 2019, 10:16:35 am
Blimey Bograt - I don't remember that! But I bet VOPS did it.
M
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: AR on September 24, 2019, 11:36:19 am
If this is the farm I think it is, then it's recently been bought by the National Trust.
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: richardg on September 24, 2019, 04:21:07 pm
Reading the information amassed here....
Its a good job this forum exists....

Otherwise if some uninformed individual or group were to go up to High Edge and start a project by chance choosing the wrong large depression in the ground  and had a mishap  it could involve more than the cave rescue...

Perhaps a bomb disposal team too, not to mention a specialist biological warfare hazards team, they might even have to evacuate all the inhabitants from a large area...

If someone wants a go at getting into the "Upper Dove Master System" perhaps looking elsewhere might be the safer option.......

Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: Roger W on September 24, 2019, 06:51:42 pm
"So, Jim, how did your late father come to discover the entrance to the UDMC system?"

"Well, he hit this chunk of metal at the bottom of a shakehole wtth his pickaxe..."
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: Mrs Trellis on September 24, 2019, 07:36:49 pm
Why did the local farmer have a Mummerset accent?
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: AR on September 24, 2019, 09:15:37 pm
I'll have a chat to my main contact at the NT and ask about doing a walkover at some point, though not in the near future as I'm out of action following a pony kick. I'll also mention the site history....
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: danthecavingman on September 24, 2019, 11:02:31 pm
More evidence to back up the story?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/sumpbung/46722294892

Not a Zeppelin, but the area was bombed in WW2 according to this snippet.

Dan.
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: SamT on September 25, 2019, 11:41:34 am
I was about to reply Dan, and your last post kinda beat me to it.

But really?!? - A Zepplin bombing open countryside in Derbyshire WW1  - seems like a tall story that!!.

WW2 I can believe.

There's a conical hole on Treak Cliff (just near the bus turn around) that is the result of a WW11 mine, dropped from a German plane that had been shot and was ditching its payload before presumably trying to get back home.
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: Jenny P on September 25, 2019, 05:57:36 pm
I do know that some members of Orpheus C.C., who had digs further down Dowell Dale at the Resurgence, Dowell Hall Cave and Etches Cave, also had a wander around the area in the 1960's and 1970's.  As soon as anyone wandered across to Piker's Pit, the farmer appeared, as if by magic, and turfed us off so we never got to have a proper look.

It did have, at the bottom of the hole, a brick-built, covered reservoir and a pump, so I always assumed that the reason for not wanting us around the site would be that we might affect someone's water supply.

Bear in mind that this was 50+years ago so the resewrvoir and pump may not be there any longer.
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: martinb on September 25, 2019, 08:01:54 pm
I was about to reply Dan, and your last post kinda beat me to it.

But really?!? - A Zepplin bombing open countryside in Derbyshire WW1  - seems like a tall story that!!.

WW2 I can believe.

There's a conical hole on Treak Cliff (just near the bus turn around) that is the result of a WW11 mine, dropped from a German plane that had been shot and was ditching its payload before presumably trying to get back home.

Whereabouts on Treak Cliff? Never heard about that one before Sam....
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: Mrs Trellis on September 26, 2019, 10:46:57 am
It's in Ford and Rieuwerts book "Lead Mining in the Peak District" on page 73.
Title: Re: PIKERS PIT
Post by: Leclused on September 26, 2019, 11:43:31 am
I was about to reply Dan, and your last post kinda beat me to it.

But really?!? - A Zepplin bombing open countryside in Derbyshire WW1  - seems like a tall story that!!.

WW2 I can believe.

There's a conical hole on Treak Cliff (just near the bus turn around) that is the result of a WW11 mine, dropped from a German plane that had been shot and was ditching its payload before presumably trying to get back home.


There was a zeppelin raid on Derby in 1916 during WW1 according to the following infomation

https://www.crichparish-ww1.co.uk/ww1webpages/zeppelinraidderby.html