First time caver-name of easy longish cave needed

[Les W]

Nearest sites would be the Wiltshire stone mines which are outside my patch regarding suitability etc. You really do need to find someone to take you round initially.

If you were to consider the Wiltshire stone quarries then I would second this advice. They are quite easy to travel through but very extensive and complex, without a guide you would soon (very soon) get lost and would also probably miss most of the good bits.

If you were to find yourself down this way then I am certain there are local explorers that would be able to help you out at the drop of a hat.

PM me for details if you need them.

 

[Brains]

To clarify does an open cast have no tunnel or just a shallow tunnel?

Would it be true that mines with shallow tunnels might have more integrity in their actual tunnels because they would be cheaper to maintain and also potentially more dangerous to the surface enviroment than deep ones - plus less weight on their supports? 

But ultimately I am really after names of mines that are already used for caving like experiences.

Regarding Yordas is the vertical cavern the only way in? ie do you need to rig a rope to get in or is it possible to walk in/climb in manually?

Thanks

An opencast is what most people might think of as a "quarry" a big open hole and (almost) nothing underground.

Shallow underground workings are no more safe, and possibly less safe than deeper workings. Permafrost has penetrated to a great depth...

Mines like Mouldridge in Derbyshire, or Swan in Wiltshire could be good, but you will miss loads of interest if you go alone. These are open access. Closer to London there are mines in the greensand, but access is controlled so you would need to arrange a trip with the keyholders. Sadly some landowners like restrictions. Other sites are restricted for their delicate nature

Yordas  main chamber can be walked into from the valley

 

[cap n chris]

Surely no sane person is going to drive from London to the Dales specifically to wander into Yordas' main chamber?

 

[owd git]

Surely no sane person is going to drive from London to the Dales specifically to wander into Yordas' main chamber?





unless.... there's a corpse to dispose of!!! in which case can we suggest a nearer cave to aviod undue stress. o.g.

 

[susie]

Shallow underground workings are no more safe, and possibly less safe than deeper workings. Permafrost has penetrated to a great depth...

As permafrost is ground that has remained at or below the freezing point of water for two or more years, it is unlikely to have been an influence on the stability of mine workings in this country.

 

[graham]

Shallow underground workings are no more safe, and possibly less safe than deeper workings. Permafrost has penetrated to a great depth...

As permafrost is ground that has remained at or below the freezing point of water for two or more years, it is unlikely to have been an influence on the stability of mine workings in this country.

Correct, however, it is still worth making the point that shallow workings may be exposed to a greater variability in seasonal climatic conditions which will lead to instability and breakdown.

I rather suspect that the point has now been made that, although mines might be easier to traverse than caves, they can have far greater stability issues and serious route-finding issues, both of which would be serious problems for the inexperienced newcomer.

 

[graham]

Surely no sane person is going to drive from London to the Dales specifically to wander into Yordas' main chamber?

A book that I was reading yesterday mentioned, in passing that one of the advertised local attractions in Perth was an interestingly shaped rock 150 miles away. So in Oz people seem to do a 300 mile round trip to look at a rock! In comparison Yordas would be a magnificent spectacle!

 

[tj]

"unless.... there's a corpse to dispose of!!! in which case can we suggest a nearer cave to aviod undue stress. o.g."

FYi - This would not be the way to dispose of a corpse, due to the fact that it would still be around and findable. I'd imagine lime,concrete or sea would be better.

I am not actually a murdererer.

 

[Clive G]

. . .

unless.... there's a corpse to dispose of!!! in which case can we suggest a nearer cave to aviod undue stress. o.g.

Given tj lives in London then . . . I was walking along the Regents Canal last Friday for some exercise and to get to Camden when suddenly there was a nice policewoman directing everyone away from the towpath because the Police were dealing with a 'scene of the crime' ahead (almost due north of King's Cross station). When I eventually returned to the canal thinking how well I'd timed things to miss the robbery or whatever argument had been going on, an inquisitive woman was asking the policeman manning the towpath closure at the western end what the reason was . . . I'm sure I heard words to the effect "a body has been found"! Now, I'm convinced that walking along the same towpath around 10 days earlier I saw a large black bin bag lying on the grass bank to the side of the towpath, near a bridge, in the same area, and I thought to myself "that looks like a dead body - no, it must be builders' rubbish - but why go to the trouble of dumping it here?"

So, no need to bother about using a cave, new motorway flyover or the sea these days, apparently. And I nearly looked in the bag to see what it might contain - but thought better! Oh, and actually there were two bags . . . of a similar size each . . .

 

[ronaldjprice]

72 or even 48hrs should be easily enough for you to arrange a companion or guide perhaps this website will help find fellow moles or follow the links page
Try to decide which caving area are you intent upon?.
Are you thinking of buying or hiring the required equipment? if so, are you aware of the right equipment to buy/hire, as this may vary depending upon venue.

As said above there are usually people that would be able to guide you or allow you to tag along with them at the drop of a hat, clubs will provide you with loan kit free why spend hundreds of pounds on kit you may never use again, if you wanted to hire all the required kit, you may only have the option of one or two suppliers. thus limiting your caving area.

If you are serious and want to cave there are many pleasure cavers that may be able help and also paid cave guides whom would be able to help well within your time scale.

There are other problems associated with various different types of mines and  even some so called "safe" mines have recently become unsafe due to unknown factors like L.R. where some explorers were very lucky to escape with their lives.
You may stumble upon, false floors, lack of oxygen, toxic gas, roof / tunnel collapse just to mention a few, they are often a labyrinth that would have you lost and exhausted.

Caves & mines may appear secretive lonesome places, but as for a hiding place they would be the last place I would use, far to much through traffic, often busier than my local pub, that is not to say you would be found in time to save your life if you were in difficulties

Hypothermia, and exhaustion can easily take down a fit man in a very short time, as for "Dangerous sports" I know several superb hard high grade climbers that would not stand a snowball in hells chance on their own in a cave / mine.(no disrespect to climbers here, just illustrating my point)

We do get great cavers who climb and the other way around, but it certainly does not infer that proficiency in one automatically mean that one will be proficient in the other.

Caving is caving not climbing or abseiling it has huge differences, and to be cave fit is no easy task, only last week I took a group of cavers, fit healthy young men all of whom had caved for some time, around an "easy" cave, by the emails I received that evening, they would not have managed another couple of hours without difficulties, including myself. I generally cave 1 or 2 times a week, often more.

I also think solo caving is legitimate and rewarding, however with extreme caution and much experience, I would recommend you get a few years and many caves , experience under your belt before trying it.

As mentioned above DCRO CRO call outs pages are a wealth of useful information, and I cant think of anyone whom has not nearly killed or injured themselves once or twice myself included.


Ron

 

[ronaldjprice]

We had a body in bin bags in a shopping trolley awaiting refuse collection day in the refuse room of local council flats for about a week, if they had bothered to put the bits in a bin they would probably not have noticed it even then.

Pigs are always good and you can feel you have done your bit for the animals, put something back into the community..

 

[ditzy 24//7]

how about swildons,goatchurch or browns folly?

 

[ronaldjprice]

Hi Ditzy,
Sorry we missed your BBQ.
Isn't Swildons a bit wet?,I don't know never been there but I though I saw some ducks on a TV prog about it..

Ron

 

[ditzy 24//7]

very wet in places...
it depends on what parts your doing.i was more or less thinking only to the first pitch,its great as a first trip.
plenty to see.you can stay reasonablyy dry unless you choose to get wet .unless the cave is in flood!
iv done it in a cotton boiler suit before fine
tho if you are going down the pitch then furry and oversuit would be recomended or a wetsuit as after the pitch it does get wet.
especaially if your going through sump one!
iv not been through the sump or done anything the other side of it yet tho.

 

[ronaldjprice]

Sound fun, we were supposed to be there camping this weekend, unfortunately Patsy's new job has her working on Sunday, so I may have to find something nearer home to play with, there is talk of Winnats Head in the near future.
Ron

 

[ditzy 24//7]

its well worth a look if your down that way

 

[cap n chris]

Pridhamsleigh?

 

[kay]

Regarding Yordas is the vertical cavern the only way in? ie do you need to rig a rope to get in or is it possible to walk in/climb in manually?

It's a walk-in - that's why I suggested it.
You wouldn't spend more than hour doing a complete poke around and crawling along the low bits. I didn't know where you were based when I suggested it, but there's plenty of other horizontal caves in the area to make up two or three days caving with no trouble.

 

[Brains]

Shallow underground workings are no more safe, and possibly less safe than deeper workings. Permafrost has penetrated to a great depth...

As permafrost is ground that has remained at or below the freezing point of water for two or more years, it is unlikely to have been an influence on the stability of mine workings in this country.

Correct, however, it is still worth making the point that shallow workings may be exposed to a greater variability in seasonal climatic conditions which will lead to instability and breakdown.

I rather suspect that the point has now been made that, although mines might be easier to traverse than caves, they can have far greater stability issues and serious route-finding issues, both of which would be serious problems for the inexperienced newcomer.

I was referring to the deep frost shattering that occurred during the ice ages and has left a legacy of deep fractures. The fine detail of the tundra geomorphology is not needed, suffice to say that shallow workings - where roots can be seen - can and will have suffered from frost heave and shattering, unless post ice age stripping of the surface has happened. The oolites of the bath stone have their share of fractures and bedding planes, causing areas of poor roof and walls. Deeper mines in other rock maybe a bit more stable, or not, depending on other factors.

 

[tj]

<<It's a walk-in - that's why I suggested it.
You wouldn't spend more than hour doing a complete poke around and crawling along the low bits. I didn't know where you were based when I suggested it, but there's plenty of other horizontal caves in the area to make up two or three days caving with no trouble.>>

Sounds interesting.

Someone mentioned that caving is more physically exerting than rocking - what would be the reason for this? is it the contortions involved in crawling through tight spaces? Or not knowing whats ahead?